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Post by BigT on Oct 21, 2023 21:07:31 GMT -6
I chalk this one up to growing pains. They played the Cup champs, looked reasonably competitive. However, in this one, I wasn’t worried about the kids as much as I was about Hall, Jones, Murphy etc. I get it, they’re not here for the long haul. The rebuild is still in the beginning stages. I still feel the Hawks will be at the bottom of the standings for another 2 seasons. It is what it is. We can’t get too low on the kids. They’ll learn.
I almost think the Hawks will surprise people and contend for a playoff spot. Or be worse than last year. I don’t think they’ll be in the middle. It’ll be a weird season either way. I personally hope the Hawks win 2 first overalls in a row. Get them the hell out of the way and try to build up better and quicker!!!
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Post by BigT on Oct 21, 2023 21:20:42 GMT -6
vlasic +2 tonight. the other 5 of the D crew were either 0 (murph, tinordi and kaiser) or -2 (korch and seth). I know Vlasic and Korchinski are the higher picks and so they get preference but I wonder how Kaiser, who I though looked OK tonight, would show if he weren’t saddled with the two biggest anchors in Tinordi and Zaitsev. I almost wish for an injury so a younger and more mobile guy like Philips would get a call up. I’ve thought that Zaitsev has been ok. Kaiser has had a couple good games. But for the most part, I think he’s looked out of his league. I think there’s something there. But he needs more seasoning in the AHL. Last game he walked out front of his net with the puck and just froze. He needs more pro experience down a league. He’s young so he gets a pass. I’m not sure what to do about Seth. He looks awful and with his contract, he’s just not moveable. Maybe Jeff Gillooly is up for hire? I really wanna like Seth. But when you demand a trade, and salary. Then suck for the past 2 years. Then whine over your brother not getting re-signed. At some point he’s gotta just play hockey. On a quick note. My buddy next door, his dad worked for Dallas Stars back in the 1990s as a public relations guy. He’s the guy he got Seth and Caleb into hockey. Popeye approached him about it. He went shopping for equipment and set the boys up. He says they’re great guys. So hearing that, Id love for them to succeed. I really would. But I think the Hawks got a massive boat anchor on their hands with that contract!!!
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Post by tincup on Oct 21, 2023 22:28:34 GMT -6
I know Vlasic and Korchinski are the higher picks and so they get preference but I wonder how Kaiser, who I though looked OK tonight, would show if he weren’t saddled with the two biggest anchors in Tinordi and Zaitsev. I almost wish for an injury so a younger and more mobile guy like Philips would get a call up. I’ve thought that Zaitsev has been ok. Kaiser has had a couple good games. But for the most part, I think he’s looked out of his league. I think there’s something there. But he needs more seasoning in the AHL. Last game he walked out front of his net with the puck and just froze. He needs more pro experience down a league. He’s young so he gets a pass. I’m not sure what to do about Seth. He looks awful and with his contract, he’s just not moveable. Maybe Jeff Gillooly is up for hire? I really wanna like Seth. But when you demand a trade, and salary. Then suck for the past 2 years. Then whine over your brother not getting re-signed. At some point he’s gotta just play hockey. On a quick note. My buddy next door, his dad worked for Dallas Stars back in the 1990s as a public relations guy. He’s the guy he got Seth and Caleb into hockey. Popeye approached him about it. He went shopping for equipment and set the boys up. He says they’re great guys. So hearing that, Id love for them to succeed. I really would. But I think the Hawks got a massive boat anchor on their hands with that contract!!! All the young guys are getting a pass to some degree, although Vlasic probably had his most complete game tonight. Korchinski has talent no doubt but his defensive reads aren’t always very good. Thing about Kaiser, depending on his partner, he’s the only guy that has to play both sides. It’s a good skill to have and versatility can only help his cause.
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Post by jacksalmon on Oct 21, 2023 23:02:11 GMT -6
Yeah, they got beat, but it was by the defending champs. The Hawks played a pretty darn good game and looked like they belonged out there unlike the other night against the Avs where it seemed they were definitely suited up for a game in the wrong league. It will be a learning process. I just hope they have the talent to apply the lessons they learn and get much better.
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Post by bigbarn27 on Oct 21, 2023 23:18:30 GMT -6
Well that was fun for a little while. Nice tribute to Rocky. Crowed was into it after CBs goal but did not last long. I kept on saying the only thing you can count on is RJ not finishing the he goes and scores. Have not seen any replays but why was Jones so high on that 3rd goal? This is the most i have watched of Hall but he is not a very good hockey player. Raddish givin a spot on top line and said no thank you..... Tonordi and Murf with very forgettable games. I thought the best movement on PP was when AA filled in for Hall. they played hard, at times the ice seemed very tilted but thats a real good team thats not relaxing. Not gonna get any easier boys gotta stay together.
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Post by malagahawks on Oct 22, 2023 0:41:27 GMT -6
Saw the highlights, they played better than in Colorado but missed a couple of opportunities on the PP. Who knows, the Hawks make 1 more PP goal and 2 of those Vegas goals were flukey so all in all it was a better effort. And Bedard got his goal!! I see some Korch comments and have seen both him & Jones with some sloppy puck handling and clearing the zone, leading to turnovers. Those turn into high quality chances or goals. Korch I can give a pass on, but Jones has got play better. I know that contract is an anchor but I don't think you will see any mention of trying to move him for at least a season or 2 when our Dmen start to mature. Right now the game is just too fast for them.
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Post by OldTimeHawky on Oct 22, 2023 3:23:51 GMT -6
Pretty late hit on Reichel there, although he should have been more alert. To his credit, he got up and threw at hit on a much bigger dman. He seemed more engaged after that but still snake bitten.
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Post by Hockey is great on Oct 22, 2023 8:12:11 GMT -6
Hawks played well for the most part. Just not much room for error or sloppiness when facing a team of Vegas caliber.
I’m a Reichel fan but he needs to be aggressive and not passive. Shoot the puck. Go to the tougher areas.
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Post by phill9 on Oct 22, 2023 9:32:44 GMT -6
I chalk this one up to growing pains. They played the Cup champs, looked reasonably competitive. However, in this one, I wasn’t worried about the kids as much as I was about Hall, Jones, Murphy etc. I get it, they’re not here for the long haul. The rebuild is still in the beginning stages. I still feel the Hawks will be at the bottom of the standings for another 2 seasons. It is what it is. We can’t get too low on the kids. They’ll learn. I almost think the Hawks will surprise people and contend for a playoff spot. Or be worse than last year. I don’t think they’ll be in the middle. It’ll be a weird season either way. I personally hope the Hawks win 2 first overalls in a row. Get them the hell out of the way and try to build up better and quicker!!! Here's my thought on that....if they do win the #1 again, then why not after the draft start pulling in the free agents to make them a contender in 2024/25? Make the necessary trades at this years trade deadline to unload the deadwood (Murphy, Hall, Foligno, Perry, Mrazek, etc), let more of the kids finish the season, and next year you may be able to add Moore, Nazar, Allen, Del Maestro, etc and the right free agents to fill in the holes. Not likely to win the cup while the 2nd wave of rookies coming in, but could make 2025/26 the year they contend.
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Post by phill9 on Oct 22, 2023 9:47:28 GMT -6
Not that they do it but Murphy should be scratched next game Zaitsev was solid in his two games Korchinski Jones Vlasic Kaiser Tinrordi Zaitsev Not going to see Murphy scratched. They anointed him and Seth as full time associate captains, with Foligno and Perry taking the 3rd A alternating between home and road games. Only way Murphy doesn't play is if he gets injured, which has been a common occurrence. Not wishing him injury, just saying it's the only way he's not in the lineup.
Pretty sad they give him an A, a player who's never played on a team with a winning record.
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Post by Hockey is great on Oct 22, 2023 9:57:40 GMT -6
Not that they do it but Murphy should be scratched next game Zaitsev was solid in his two games Korchinski Jones Vlasic Kaiser Tinrordi Zaitsev Not going to see Murphy scratched. They anointed him and Seth as full time associate captains, with Foligno and Perry taking the 3rd A alternating between home and road games. Only way Murphy doesn't play is if he gets injured, which has been a common occurrence. Not wishing him injury, just saying it's the only way he's not in the lineup.
Pretty sad they give him an A, a player who's never played on a team with a winning record. I know
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Post by jacksalmon on Oct 22, 2023 10:49:01 GMT -6
I chalk this one up to growing pains. They played the Cup champs, looked reasonably competitive. However, in this one, I wasn’t worried about the kids as much as I was about Hall, Jones, Murphy etc. I get it, they’re not here for the long haul. The rebuild is still in the beginning stages. I still feel the Hawks will be at the bottom of the standings for another 2 seasons. It is what it is. We can’t get too low on the kids. They’ll learn. I almost think the Hawks will surprise people and contend for a playoff spot. Or be worse than last year. I don’t think they’ll be in the middle. It’ll be a weird season either way. I personally hope the Hawks win 2 first overalls in a row. Get them the hell out of the way and try to build up better and quicker!!! Here is why I can't get rid of serious concerns about how much longer it is going to take to be seriously competitive. In Kane's second year, the 2008-09 season, the roster included, besides Kane: Bolland, Brouwer, Byfuglien, Campbell, Havlat, the Hammer, Keith, Ladd, Seabrook, Sharp, Toews and Versteeg. Then, they got Hossa for the 09-10 season. It's no wonder they were favored to win the Cup in 2010 and did. Just compare that 08/09 roster to the current one and one gets the picture of how far this team is away from seriously contending, especially given the fact that many of the teams against whom they are competing are still in the ascending phase of their team quality. While it is true that some of the current rookies may have careers that become the equivalent of some of the players on that 08/09 roster, it is pretty clear to me that the current team does not really measure up in potential, nor numbers of such quality players. Of even more concern to me is that none (except Bedard) of the current crop of young forwards will even come close to the point totals amassed by the forwards from that 08/09 team, who were growing into their full potential as Cup winners. The team will definitely need to make a few trades that are steals; or acquire some top notch free agents to even approach the quality of the ascending 08/09 team. I keep harping on the 08/09 team to demonstrate what a team looks like when it is really growing into a serious Cup contender. This current crop of Hawks ain't even close.
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Post by steamer on Oct 22, 2023 12:00:41 GMT -6
I think they are right on track. I also compare them to the previous upcoming championship team but that’s probably not the way to do it. It’s going to take a couple of years to build the team. We are still very early in the process and so so fortunate to have landed Bedard.
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Post by LordKOTL on Oct 22, 2023 12:19:08 GMT -6
Yeah, they got beat, but it was by the defending champs. The Hawks played a pretty darn good game and looked like they belonged out there unlike the other night against the Avs where it seemed they were definitely suited up for a game in the wrong league. It will be a learning process. I just hope they have the talent to apply the lessons they learn and get much better. Exactly. I'm hoping that, too. The kids look like they are in the process or they belong (i.e. Great game Pickle), and some of the vets like Perry are doing what they need to. some vets are meh. (Jones last 2 games) and some are the 2nd coming of Cullimore (Murphy. Both wore 5. Coincidence? I think not!) Hopefully Kyle from Chicago is paying attention. If I was him and LR, if the trend of the 1st 6 games continues, I'd be stripping Murph and maybe Seth of a letter and givibg it to soneone who is showing real leadership. Might hasten a trade.
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Post by squishy24 on Oct 22, 2023 13:26:19 GMT -6
I chalk this one up to growing pains. They played the Cup champs, looked reasonably competitive. However, in this one, I wasn’t worried about the kids as much as I was about Hall, Jones, Murphy etc. I get it, they’re not here for the long haul. The rebuild is still in the beginning stages. I still feel the Hawks will be at the bottom of the standings for another 2 seasons. It is what it is. We can’t get too low on the kids. They’ll learn. I almost think the Hawks will surprise people and contend for a playoff spot. Or be worse than last year. I don’t think they’ll be in the middle. It’ll be a weird season either way. I personally hope the Hawks win 2 first overalls in a row. Get them the hell out of the way and try to build up better and quicker!!! Here is why I can't get rid of serious concerns about how much longer it is going to take to be seriously competitive. In Kane's second year, the 2008-09 season, the roster included, besides Kane: Bolland, Brouwer, Byfuglien, Campbell, Havlat, the Hammer, Keith, Ladd, Seabrook, Sharp, Toews and Versteeg. Then, they got Hossa for the 09-10 season. It's no wonder they were favored to win the Cup in 2010 and did. Just compare that 08/09 roster to the current one and one gets the picture of how far this team is away from seriously contending, especially given the fact that many of the teams against whom they are competing are still in the ascending phase of their team quality. While it is true that some of the current rookies may have careers that become the equivalent of some of the players on that 08/09 roster, it is pretty clear to me that the current team does not really measure up in potential, nor numbers of such quality players. Of even more concern to me is that none (except Bedard) of the current crop of young forwards will even come close to the point totals amassed by the forwards from that 08/09 team, who were growing into their full potential as Cup winners. The team will definitely need to make a few trades that are steals; or acquire some top notch free agents to even approach the quality of the ascending 08/09 team. I keep harping on the 08/09 team to demonstrate what a team looks like when it is really growing into a serious Cup contender. This current crop of Hawks ain't even close. If youre going to compare current to TK era, current needs another top pick. Kane had Toews (vice versa), so far Bedard is on his own
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Post by jacksalmon on Oct 22, 2023 17:38:47 GMT -6
Here is why I can't get rid of serious concerns about how much longer it is going to take to be seriously competitive. In Kane's second year, the 2008-09 season, the roster included, besides Kane: Bolland, Brouwer, Byfuglien, Campbell, Havlat, the Hammer, Keith, Ladd, Seabrook, Sharp, Toews and Versteeg. Then, they got Hossa for the 09-10 season. It's no wonder they were favored to win the Cup in 2010 and did. Just compare that 08/09 roster to the current one and one gets the picture of how far this team is away from seriously contending, especially given the fact that many of the teams against whom they are competing are still in the ascending phase of their team quality. While it is true that some of the current rookies may have careers that become the equivalent of some of the players on that 08/09 roster, it is pretty clear to me that the current team does not really measure up in potential, nor numbers of such quality players. Of even more concern to me is that none (except Bedard) of the current crop of young forwards will even come close to the point totals amassed by the forwards from that 08/09 team, who were growing into their full potential as Cup winners. The team will definitely need to make a few trades that are steals; or acquire some top notch free agents to even approach the quality of the ascending 08/09 team. I keep harping on the 08/09 team to demonstrate what a team looks like when it is really growing into a serious Cup contender. This current crop of Hawks ain't even close. If youre going to compare current to TK era, current needs another top pick. Kane had Toews (vice versa), so far Bedard is on his own That is very true and exactly why they are a long way from being seriously competitive. But, regardless of the Kane/Toews pairing, this team does not even come close to having the same quality other forwards I named from the 08/09 team. For example, Havlat, Sharp and Versteeg compared to Reichel, Johnson and Entwhistle; or take any other three from this team you choose to compare to the three from the 08/09 team I named. I am not posting to take an opportunity to knock the current crop, but only to point out how far away this current team is from the conglomeration of excellence the Cup competitive 08/09 team had.
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Post by galaxytrash on Oct 22, 2023 17:45:33 GMT -6
If youre going to compare current to TK era, current needs another top pick. Kane had Toews (vice versa), so far Bedard is on his own That is very true and exactly why they are a long way from being seriously competitive. But, regardless of the Kane/Toews pairing, this team does not even come close to having the same quality other forwards I named from the 08/09 team. For example, Havlat, Sharp and Versteeg compared to Reichel, Johnson and Entwhistle; or take any other three from this team you choose to compare to the three from the 08/09 team I named. I am not posting to take an opportunity to knock the current crop, but only to point out how far away this current team is from the conglomeration of excellence the Cup competitive 08/09 team had. it wasn't until his 6th season that sharpie started getting noticed. www.nhl.com/player/patrick-sharp-8469544we got quite a bit of talent in the pipeline that may not take nearly that long...hopefully. hell, we might have guys we haven't even drafted yet ready to step in before 6 seasons.
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Post by jacksalmon on Oct 22, 2023 22:10:34 GMT -6
That is very true and exactly why they are a long way from being seriously competitive. But, regardless of the Kane/Toews pairing, this team does not even come close to having the same quality other forwards I named from the 08/09 team. For example, Havlat, Sharp and Versteeg compared to Reichel, Johnson and Entwhistle; or take any other three from this team you choose to compare to the three from the 08/09 team I named. I am not posting to take an opportunity to knock the current crop, but only to point out how far away this current team is from the conglomeration of excellence the Cup competitive 08/09 team had. it wasn't until his 6th season that sharpie started getting noticed. www.nhl.com/player/patrick-sharp-8469544we got quite a bit of talent in the pipeline that may not take nearly that long...hopefully. hell, we might have guys we haven't even drafted yet ready to step in before 6 seasons. I guess it is possible that some of the current crop of young Hawks will be playing well by their 6th season. That would be great, but given what I see now, it is hard to look that far forward and expect to see some good numbers of goals and assists. Good luck to 'em, they are going to need a lot of it. Besides, my point isn't so much that the current young crop will never be better. It is that they aren't ready to pop this year, nor probably for a couple of years after that, if at all. So, I wouldn't be looking for this team to be Cup competitive for several years, if it all works out. That 08/09 team had numerous guys ready to pop, even it took them four, five, or six years before that year to start developing. The current Hawk team doesn't have any guys who are in their fifth, or sixth year of development and are ready to perform solidly, like Sharp did in his sixth year.
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Post by squishy24 on Oct 22, 2023 22:15:09 GMT -6
If youre going to compare current to TK era, current needs another top pick. Kane had Toews (vice versa), so far Bedard is on his own That is very true and exactly why they are a long way from being seriously competitive. But, regardless of the Kane/Toews pairing, this team does not even come close to having the same quality other forwards I named from the 08/09 team. For example, Havlat, Sharp and Versteeg compared to Reichel, Johnson and Entwhistle; or take any other three from this team you choose to compare to the three from the 08/09 team I named. I am not posting to take an opportunity to knock the current crop, but only to point out how far away this current team is from the conglomeration of excellence the Cup competitive 08/09 team had. I mentioned this before, when Avs won their cup, they were the fastest from bottoming out to winning the cup. And i believe that was 5-6 yrs. And they already have Mckinnon and Landeskog. Our rebuild is literally from no stars (maybe Seth Jones). I say the timeline to being cup contenders will at least be 2030.
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Post by jacksalmon on Oct 22, 2023 22:22:50 GMT -6
That is very true and exactly why they are a long way from being seriously competitive. But, regardless of the Kane/Toews pairing, this team does not even come close to having the same quality other forwards I named from the 08/09 team. For example, Havlat, Sharp and Versteeg compared to Reichel, Johnson and Entwhistle; or take any other three from this team you choose to compare to the three from the 08/09 team I named. I am not posting to take an opportunity to knock the current crop, but only to point out how far away this current team is from the conglomeration of excellence the Cup competitive 08/09 team had. I mentioned this before, when Avs won their cup, they were the fastest from bottoming out to winning the cup. And i believe that was 5-6 yrs. And they already have Mckinnon and Landeskog. Our rebuild is literally from no stars (maybe Seth Jones). I say the timeline to being cup contenders will at least be 2030. That's probably getting more realistic. Time will tell whether today's youngsters will be tomorrow's stars. Who knows how it will go?
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Post by hsbob on Oct 23, 2023 0:28:37 GMT -6
it wasn't until his 6th season that sharpie started getting noticed. www.nhl.com/player/patrick-sharp-8469544we got quite a bit of talent in the pipeline that may not take nearly that long...hopefully. hell, we might have guys we haven't even drafted yet ready to step in before 6 seasons. I guess it is possible that some of the current crop of young Hawks will be playing well by their 6th season. That would be great, but given what I see now, it is hard to look that far forward and expect to see some good numbers of goals and assists. Good luck to 'em, they are going to need a lot of it. Besides, my point isn't so much that the current young crop will never be better. It is that they aren't ready to pop this year, nor probably for a couple of years after that, if at all. So, I wouldn't be looking for this team to be Cup competitive for several years, if it all works out. That 08/09 team had numerous guys ready to pop, even it took them four, five, or six years before that year to start developing. The current Hawk team doesn't have any guys who are in their fifth, or sixth year of development and are ready to perform solidly, like Sharp did in his sixth year. To be objective,we are talking about a team that added Bedard and Moore to their already top-rated prospect pool and a team that possesses an amount of quality draft capitol and cap-space most teams can only dream of. Some very good,young players were moved out in this effort..........results should be demanded at some point. I'll accept another down year but they better get Bedard somebody to play with before too long.
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Post by jacksalmon on Oct 23, 2023 9:52:41 GMT -6
I guess it is possible that some of the current crop of young Hawks will be playing well by their 6th season. That would be great, but given what I see now, it is hard to look that far forward and expect to see some good numbers of goals and assists. Good luck to 'em, they are going to need a lot of it. Besides, my point isn't so much that the current young crop will never be better. It is that they aren't ready to pop this year, nor probably for a couple of years after that, if at all. So, I wouldn't be looking for this team to be Cup competitive for several years, if it all works out. That 08/09 team had numerous guys ready to pop, even it took them four, five, or six years before that year to start developing. The current Hawk team doesn't have any guys who are in their fifth, or sixth year of development and are ready to perform solidly, like Sharp did in his sixth year. To be objective,we are talking about a team that added Bedard and Moore to their already top-rated prospect pool and a team that possesses an amount of quality draft capitol and cap-space most teams can only dream of. Some very good,young players were moved out in this effort..........results should be demanded at some point. I'll accept another down year but they better get Bedard somebody to play with before too long. Speaking of very good young players who were moved out, how 'bout that DCat up in Detroit? What a start for the guy!!!!! Yes, they have more draft picks to use and a ton of money to buy free agents. Maybe next year, or the one after, they will start to use some of that money. It will be necessary to do so because I don't think that Bedard will be helped that much by his fellow rookies. That is why I went back to the 08/09 team to show how ready they were to get the Cup in 2010, after getting Hossa. They had so many good players ready to win it all. This team will not be in that form for years to come, if ever, and will not get there without seriously buying free agents.
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Post by Nikos on Oct 23, 2023 10:07:25 GMT -6
To be objective,we are talking about a team that added Bedard and Moore to their already top-rated prospect pool and a team that possesses an amount of quality draft capitol and cap-space most teams can only dream of. Some very good,young players were moved out in this effort..........results should be demanded at some point. I'll accept another down year but they better get Bedard somebody to play with before too long. Speaking of very good young players who were moved out, how 'bout that DCat up in Detroit? What a start for the guy!!!!! Yes, they have more draft picks to use and a ton of money to buy free agents. Maybe next year, or the one after, they will start to use some of that money. It will be necessary to do so because I don't think that Bedard will be helped that much by his fellow rookies. That is why I went back to the 08/09 team to show how ready they were to get the Cup in 2010, after getting Hossa. They had so many good players ready to win it all. This team will not be in that form for years to come, if ever, and will not get there without seriously buying free agents. The signing of big-time free agents will come. Still in the early stages of the rebuild. As much as we want to look ahead, rebuilds are not easy nor are they quick. You cited early how long it took the Avs. Look at Detroit, Buffalo getting closer and New Jersey already there. Besides a lot of free agents will want to come here to play with Bedard, original 6 franchise, great sports town and big media market.
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Post by jacksalmon on Oct 23, 2023 10:53:13 GMT -6
Speaking of very good young players who were moved out, how 'bout that DCat up in Detroit? What a start for the guy!!!!! Yes, they have more draft picks to use and a ton of money to buy free agents. Maybe next year, or the one after, they will start to use some of that money. It will be necessary to do so because I don't think that Bedard will be helped that much by his fellow rookies. That is why I went back to the 08/09 team to show how ready they were to get the Cup in 2010, after getting Hossa. They had so many good players ready to win it all. This team will not be in that form for years to come, if ever, and will not get there without seriously buying free agents. The signing of big-time free agents will come. Still in the early stages of the rebuild. As much as we want to look ahead, rebuilds are not easy nor are they quick. You cited early how long it took the Avs. Look at Detroit, Buffalo getting closer and New Jersey already there. Besides a lot of free agents will want to come here to play with Bedard, original 6 franchise, great sports town and big media market. Hopefully, Bedard will still be around when his rookie contract is up and that he doesn't get fed up with losing and sees a good future for himself within a good team. If they don't improve, he might get unhappy and bolt and no one could blame him. From what I have seen, the rookie dmen are doing ok, but the same is not true, for me, with the rookie forwards, who have not impressed me at all, especially Reichel. Not even free agents will want to come to Chicago to play with that group, even if it includes Bedard. For illustration, I can't imagine it took much to get Hossa to show up for 09/10 when he saw what was already built. No free agent today could possibly see in this team what Hossa saw in the 08/09 team when he decided to join the crew for the 09/10 season. There is a big difference between occasionally scoring a goal, as a result of pure hustle, and consistently producing good scoring opportunities from skillful offensive play. Right now, this team is more the former than the latter and that is my biggest concern.
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Post by Nikos on Oct 23, 2023 11:45:38 GMT -6
The signing of big-time free agents will come. Still in the early stages of the rebuild. As much as we want to look ahead, rebuilds are not easy nor are they quick. You cited early how long it took the Avs. Look at Detroit, Buffalo getting closer and New Jersey already there. Besides a lot of free agents will want to come here to play with Bedard, original 6 franchise, great sports town and big media market. Hopefully, Bedard will still be around when his rookie contract is up and that he doesn't get fed up with losing and sees a good future for himself within a good team. If they don't improve, he might get unhappy and bolt and no one could blame him. From what I have seen, the rookie dmen are doing ok, but the same is not true, for me, with the rookie forwards, who have not impressed me at all, especially Reichel. Not even free agents will want to come to Chicago to play with that group, even if it includes Bedard. For illustration, I can't imagine it took much to get Hossa to show up for 09/10 when he saw what was already built. No free agent today could possibly see in this team what Hossa saw in the 08/09 team when he decided to join the crew for the 09/10 season. There is a big difference between occasionally scoring a goal, as a result of pure hustle, and consistently producing good scoring opportunities from skillful offensive play. Right now, this team is more the former than the latter and that is my biggest concern. Teams and General Mangers are signing players who on their rookie contract after the first year or second year. Owen Power from Buffalo basically played one full season and just signed a massive long term deal. I expect the Hawks to do something similar with Bedard, he is not going anywhere anytime soon.
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Post by ebonyraptor on Oct 23, 2023 13:13:34 GMT -6
I guess it is possible that some of the current crop of young Hawks will be playing well by their 6th season. That would be great, but given what I see now, it is hard to look that far forward and expect to see some good numbers of goals and assists. Good luck to 'em, they are going to need a lot of it. Besides, my point isn't so much that the current young crop will never be better. It is that they aren't ready to pop this year, nor probably for a couple of years after that, if at all. So, I wouldn't be looking for this team to be Cup competitive for several years, if it all works out. That 08/09 team had numerous guys ready to pop, even it took them four, five, or six years before that year to start developing. The current Hawk team doesn't have any guys who are in their fifth, or sixth year of development and are ready to perform solidly, like Sharp did in his sixth year. To be objective,we are talking about a team that added Bedard and Moore to their already top-rated prospect pool and a team that possesses an amount of quality draft capitol and cap-space most teams can only dream of. Some very good,young players were moved out in this effort..........results should be demanded at some point. I'll accept another down year but they better get Bedard somebody to play with before too long. Yep. As soon as Daly flipped over the Hawks logo revealing the Hawks would draft 1st - the first order of business was to acquire linemates for Bedard to pay with. So they acquired Hall which seemed like a good fit for one of Bedard's wings. For the other wing they decided someone already on the roster would suffice. Well, through 6 games it looks more like Hall isn't a good fit to play with Bedard and no one on the roster has been able to seize his opportunity. I get it - it's only been 6 games but so far the results are less than hoped for.
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Post by hsbob on Oct 23, 2023 13:30:07 GMT -6
Speaking of very good young players who were moved out, how 'bout that DCat up in Detroit? What a start for the guy!!!!! Yes, they have more draft picks to use and a ton of money to buy free agents. Maybe next year, or the one after, they will start to use some of that money. It will be necessary to do so because I don't think that Bedard will be helped that much by his fellow rookies. That is why I went back to the 08/09 team to show how ready they were to get the Cup in 2010, after getting Hossa. They had so many good players ready to win it all. This team will not be in that form for years to come, if ever, and will not get there without seriously buying free agents. The signing of big-time free agents will come. Still in the early stages of the rebuild. As much as we want to look ahead, rebuilds are not easy nor are they quick. You cited early how long it took the Avs. Look at Detroit, Buffalo getting closer and New Jersey already there. Besides a lot of free agents will want to come here to play with Bedard, original 6 franchise, great sports town and big media market.I agree with the bolded and I've said as much myself,the flip-side of that is,Bedard will want to play with good players before long too. He's a smart kid and he realizes what the team is this year but the look on his face at times tells me he didn't come here to F around for the next 2-3 years. No one wants the team to mortgage it's future but the already top prospect pool adds Bedard a promising Moore and maybe some of the 'KING'S RANSOME' of picks the next three years can be used to solidify the rebuild and if that speeds things up a bit,I doubt we'd mind. An impact player or two in their early-mid 20's will make the transition of the many kids to come easier IMO. Ottawa is in a massive bind with Shane Pinto,they can't let him sit-out the year and I doubt his camp would accept that and they sure as hell don't want to trade him to an EC opponent. Stutzel's their 21yro stud 1LC,Norris is healthy and was their 23yro stud 1LC before his injury(now 3LC),Giroux is a career center playing 1st line wing,Brady's played a lotta center and is now also a 1st line wing and 21 yro Ridly Grieg has looked good @2lc for the Sens so far too.
Ottawa's sitin' with 45K of cap-space at the moment and no real spot for the 22ryo center with Norris' return and Grieg's emergence and they've played well w/o the player. He can be had and maybe target 24yro,6'3' 223LB bottom six center,Mark Kastelic along the way....... www.hockeyfights.com/players/21159He plays a physical but honest game and he can skate,but he'll still take em all on when necessary,he had big WHL numbers as a Jr and a decent 14/28 64gm rookie season but he's relegated to a 4th line,tough role with Ottawa's forward depth. Bigger forwards can come around in their mid 20's,I know it's a tremendous leap but look at Tage Thompson's numbers before his two breakthrough seasons at the same age but with even lesser pedigree. Then Sens also have no spot for 23yro 6'5" 215lb,2nd round LW Egor Sokolov,the big Russian is due his RFA deal next year after three solid seasons in Belleville and three good ones in the 'Q' before that. He's paid his dues and developed nicely but he won't get a sniff with the Sens........they have a bunch of big,tough,young,talented forwards they've already made max commitments to. The only contribution Ottawa is getting from these three young forwards combined at the moment is Kastelic's replaceable 4th line minutes,the right offer makes all three expendable. Other teams will find themselves with decent,young redundancies in their system as well and Dorian will have to do something at some point........he is the guy who traded 24yro GT Gustavsson to MN,straight-up for 35yro Cam Talbot. It's probably not time for big signings as you said but there are always exceptions for the right,young player acquisition too,depending on the opportunity. Vancouver might not be where 24yro superstar LW Elias Pettersson wants to sign long-term(ala DeBrincat)when his RFA is due next summer. Acquire this young player through an offer-sheet or trade and Bedard might be lookin' at scoring titles! Even the best plans need to have some flexibility when opportunities to acquire the right,YOUNG players present themselves and the team has all the resources to do some bigger things w/o compromising the future at all IMO.
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Post by Nikos on Oct 23, 2023 16:08:08 GMT -6
The signing of big-time free agents will come. Still in the early stages of the rebuild. As much as we want to look ahead, rebuilds are not easy nor are they quick. You cited early how long it took the Avs. Look at Detroit, Buffalo getting closer and New Jersey already there. Besides a lot of free agents will want to come here to play with Bedard, original 6 franchise, great sports town and big media market.I agree with the bolded and I've said as much myself,the flip-side of that is,Bedard will want to play with good players before long too. He's a smart kid and he realizes what the team is this year but the look on his face at times tells me he didn't come here to F around for the next 2-3 years. No one wants the team to mortgage it's future but the already top prospect pool adds Bedard a promising Moore and maybe some of the 'KING'S RANSOME' of picks the next three years can be used to solidify the rebuild and if that speeds things up a bit,I doubt we'd mind. An impact player or two in their early-mid 20's will make the transition of the many kids to come easier IMO. Ottawa is in a massive bind with Shane Pinto,they can't let him sit-out the year and I doubt his camp would accept that and they sure as hell don't want to trade him to an EC opponent. Stutzel's their 21yro stud 1LC,Norris is healthy and was their 23yro stud 1LC before his injury(now 3LC),Giroux is a career center playing 1st line wing,Brady's played a lotta center and is now also a 1st line wing and 21 yro Ridly Grieg has looked good @2lc for the Sens so far too.
Ottawa's sitin' with 45K of cap-space at the moment and no real spot for the 22ryo center with Norris' return and Grieg's emergence and they've played well w/o the player. He can be had and maybe target 24yro,6'3' 223LB bottom six center,Mark Kastelic along the way....... www.hockeyfights.com/players/21159He plays a physical but honest game and he can skate,but he'll still take em all on when necessary,he had big WHL numbers as a Jr and a decent 14/28 64gm rookie season but he's relegated to a 4th line,tough role with Ottawa's forward depth. Bigger forwards can come around in their mid 20's,I know it's a tremendous leap but look at Tage Thompson's numbers before his two breakthrough seasons at the same age but with even lesser pedigree. Then Sens also have no spot for 23yro 6'5" 215lb,2nd round LW Egor Sokolov,the big Russian is due his RFA deal next year after three solid seasons in Belleville and three good ones in the 'Q' before that. He's paid his dues and developed nicely but he won't get a sniff with the Sens........they have a bunch of big,tough,young,talented forwards they've already made max commitments to. The only contribution Ottawa is getting from these three young forwards combined at the moment is Kastelic's replaceable 4th line minutes,the right offer makes all three expendable. Other teams will find themselves with decent,young redundancies in their system as well and Dorian will have to do something at some point........he is the guy who traded 24yro GT Gustavsson to MN,straight-up for 35yro Cam Talbot. It's probably not time for big signings as you said but there are always exceptions for the right,young player acquisition too,depending on the opportunity. Vancouver might not be where 24yro superstar LW Elias Pettersson wants to sign long-term(ala DeBrincat)when his RFA is due next summer. Acquire this young player through an offer-sheet or trade and Bedard might be lookin' at scoring titles! Even the best plans need to have some flexibility when opportunities to acquire the right,YOUNG players present themselves and the team has all the resources to do some bigger things w/o compromising the future at all IMO. Already in just 6 games Bedard is very hard on himself, and his expectations of his play are at a very high bar, which is a good thing. That is what makes him special, he wants to be one of the best and the Hawks owe it to him to get high end talent sooner rather than later as he is a competitive kid who loves the game and does not want to waste time while management tries to figure out who should be his linemates.
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Post by jacksalmon on Oct 23, 2023 18:59:18 GMT -6
Hopefully, Bedard will still be around when his rookie contract is up and that he doesn't get fed up with losing and sees a good future for himself within a good team. If they don't improve, he might get unhappy and bolt and no one could blame him. From what I have seen, the rookie dmen are doing ok, but the same is not true, for me, with the rookie forwards, who have not impressed me at all, especially Reichel. Not even free agents will want to come to Chicago to play with that group, even if it includes Bedard. For illustration, I can't imagine it took much to get Hossa to show up for 09/10 when he saw what was already built. No free agent today could possibly see in this team what Hossa saw in the 08/09 team when he decided to join the crew for the 09/10 season. There is a big difference between occasionally scoring a goal, as a result of pure hustle, and consistently producing good scoring opportunities from skillful offensive play. Right now, this team is more the former than the latter and that is my biggest concern. Teams and General Mangers are signing players who on their rookie contract after the first year or second year. Owen Power from Buffalo basically played one full season and just signed a massive long term deal. I expect the Hawks to do something similar with Bedard, he is not going anywhere anytime soon. He doesn't have to sign any long term deal just because one is presented to him. He may just evaluate the quality of the team in the context of his own needs as an individual to achieve NHL stardom. He can't do that by himself. He needs some serious help from linemates and 2d and 3d lines.
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Post by steamer on Oct 23, 2023 22:33:27 GMT -6
He does need serious help and it will be coming in time. . . both other young players and targeted veterans. Certainly mgmt is aware of what younger vets are now and will be available and they hopefully will exercise some good judgement on the fit with the team, etc. It takes time when you start from the bottom and yes - Kane came into a team much further along than Bedard did.
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