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Post by vadarx on Sept 22, 2020 16:54:27 GMT -6
if we get a 1st rounder for Stromer I'll shit in my pants and do cartwheels after. that'd be fantastic. I'd also love to have Danault back, but he is a UFA after next season, so I won't get too excited about it cuz he is likely only back for one season... Considering the law of gravity, I'd hope you would reconsider doing cartwheels after your........uh...."anal episode." š
I thought that might properly state my lack of belief of that scenario happening.....š
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Post by acesandeights on Sept 22, 2020 16:57:23 GMT -6
As much as I don't want Strome gone if the Hawks have Danault for 3C, possibly 2C if Dach struggles, he's kind of expendable. I heard a scenario of trading Strome for a 1st round pick and a prospect or a 2nd/3rd pick, I'd do that if they traded Saad to Montreal. if we get a 1st rounder for Stromer I'll shit in my pants and do cartwheels after. that'd be fantastic. I'd also love to have Danault back, but he is a UFA after next sa eason, so I won't get too excited about it cuz he is likely only back for one season... That's a good point. Someone is going to have to explain the positives to me. If the Hawks traded Saad, they lose a 21+ goal scorer the past two seasons. Who replaces Saad and his 21 and 23 g's? Isn't Saad a future UFA, like Danault? (assuming Danault would leave at the end of the season) If he's traded for Danault, who will be a UFA after next season, I guess I'm not seeing how it helps the Hawks in the long run to trade Saad for a player who could also leave after next season. It's like Saad is being traded for a rental. At the end of next season, Saad would be gone, Danault could leave so the Hawks could wind up empty handed. That's not how you rebuild a team. If you're rebuilding, draft picks and/or young prospects or maybe a good young player, helps for the future; one year out of a guy that could then leave doesn't, unless they know they could resign Danault. I also wonder what having one year left on a deal does to a guy's trade value. Would the trade be made for cap reasons? Wouldn't it help the team more if a Saad trade fetched a return with a more long term impact. That's why I said earlier someone is going to have to explain the positives to me. Granted though, it's all just speculation. side question: Is there interest by the Hawks in keeping Saad around beyond next season? Would Danault have any interest in the Hawks after next season? Surely he would shop around. My comments were based on Danault leaving for another team after his contract is up. It's the same scenario for Montreal. I don't see how Montreal benefits by trading Danault in return for getting one year out of Saad, who could leave them after next season. unless they know they could resign him. They're then left empty handed also, just like the Hawks would be. Surely they would want something in return to help in the future. just my very unexpert opinion. I'm just trying to look at a Saad/Danault deal from a long term perspective, which is what Stan should be doing.
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Post by BigT on Sept 24, 2020 16:04:23 GMT -6
Iāve waited to get my thoughts in order to decide what would be the best thing to do. Here she goes!
First I would tell the core group itās over, and weāre going in a race to the bottom to get the top picks. Weāre not even trying to win, weāre in a rebuild mode. If you want in on that, and will help the kids out, weād be elated to have you. If you want to win, letās talk teams all of you are willing to go to.
1st) I trade Kane and retain half his salary to the Rags for Kakko, 2021 1st round pick and KāAndre Miller or alias Andersen.
2nd) I trade Toews to Colorado for Bowen Byram and a 2020 1st round pick. Iād want another solid prospect if I retained half his salary.
3rd) With all the cap space created, I call Vancouver and take on Loui Erickssons 6 million per year salary as theyāve got a crunch. Iād also demand Podkolzin as part of the return.
4) Iād trade Saad and retain half his salary to either Toronta for the 15th pick or to Edmonton for their 1st rounder.
5) I would look around the league to see who needs a salary dump, and Iād take more and more from them.
So Iād d end up with 3 1st rounder, Kakko, Podkolzin, Byram, Miller and thatās a great start to a rebuild. Add in Dach, Strome, Dcat and the base is there for a quick rebuild. I doubt ole Scambo pulls off anything as heās still chasing the dream that he was never in!!!
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Post by shooter61 on Sept 24, 2020 19:36:49 GMT -6
(First I would tell the core group itās over, and weāre going in a race to the bottom to get the top picks. Weāre not even trying to win, weāre in a rebuild mode.) I bet that would inspire the rest of the team, , and why would the rags do that, kane's a super star, but not worth a 1at and 2nd overall, I think you are over evaluating JT PK and BS, but hey I'm all for it , just not gona happen . In my opinion
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Post by hsbob on Sept 24, 2020 19:41:24 GMT -6
(First I would tell the core group itās over, and weāre going in a race to the bottom to get the top picks. Weāre not even trying to win, weāre in a rebuild mode.) I bet that would inspire the rest of the team, , and why would the rags do that, kane's a super star, but not worth a 1at and 2nd overall, I think you are over evaluating JT PK and BS, but hey I'm all for it , just not gona happen . In my opinion You don't think Kane and Toews at half F'n price bring a big return? Much lesser players than these two bring 1st round picks at the TDL every year.
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Post by BigT on Sept 25, 2020 5:49:34 GMT -6
(First I would tell the core group itās over, and weāre going in a race to the bottom to get the top picks. Weāre not even trying to win, weāre in a rebuild mode.) I bet that would inspire the rest of the team, , and why would the rags do that, kane's a super star, but not worth a 1at and 2nd overall, I think you are over evaluating JT PK and BS, but hey I'm all for it , just not gona happen . In my opinion 1) The team is in a worse position than rebuilding. Look what the Rags did. They sent a letter out to their fans that theyāve had enough of trying to add fringe players and go for it when it was no longer possible. It is no longer possible here. Stan has traded away top players and brought in what he deems a fit. It hasnāt worked and it wonāt work. 2) The Rags are now in a good position to win. Theyāre gonna have Lafreniere cheap for 3 years. Kane conveniently has 3 years left. And if they get him at half price, Iād bet not just them, but a few other teams would give up a lot a more than Iāve said to get him. Also Kane and Panera were dyn O mite together and instead of waiting on Kakko to develop, they have Kane that can win in the 3 year window of Lafreniere. At the end of Lafrenieres ELC, heās gonna want 12-13 million, and they have Panera with that much. Itās a perfect storm for both teams. 3) Does it happen? Probably not. I think the Hawks chase the dream till the end of Toews and Kaneās deals and then theyāll walk off into the sunset and the team could be mostly rebuilt that point. Instead weāre gonna have a failing team with 2 stars left thatās close but not close enough to the bottom. Iām just merely throwing out a scenario that I believe will benefit both teams and help with a quick rebuild. 4) We have assets that are wasting away here. I doubt thereās fans allowed back in this year anyways. Theyāre talking about a 4 city bubble scenario now. So it would probably be best to do this now. Because if they re-sign the duo in a few years, theyāre gonna have to overpay to get them to stay and the cap would be screwed for another 4-5 years. The dream is over. The sooner you admit that, the sooner you can come to grips that your jersey you spent a ton on is now a relic of the past. It is what it is. Mismanagement coupled with an aging team is what you see here. Youāll see more of the same with the inexperience behind the bench, and in the front office. Stan has now surrounded himself with all inexperienced guys in the office. Stan really has now experience in hockey besides what was given to him. Itās over!!!
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Post by hsbob on Sept 25, 2020 9:08:26 GMT -6
(First I would tell the core group itās over, and weāre going in a race to the bottom to get the top picks. Weāre not even trying to win, weāre in a rebuild mode.) I bet that would inspire the rest of the team, , and why would the rags do that, kane's a super star, but not worth a 1at and 2nd overall, I think you are over evaluating JT PK and BS, but hey I'm all for it , just not gona happen . In my opinion 1) The team is in a worse position than rebuilding. Look what the Rags did. They sent a letter out to their fans that theyāve had enough of trying to add fringe players and go for it when it was no longer possible. It is no longer possible here. Stan has traded away top players and brought in what he deems a fit. It hasnāt worked and it wonāt work. 2) The Rags are now in a good position to win. Theyāre gonna have Lafreniere cheap for 3 years. Kane conveniently has 3 years left. And if they get him at half price, Iād bet not just them, but a few other teams would give up a lot a more than Iāve said to get him. Also Kane and Panera were dyn O mite together and instead of waiting on Kakko to develop, they have Kane that can win in the 3 year window of Lafreniere. At the end of Lafrenieres ELC, heās gonna want 12-13 million, and they have Panera with that much. Itās a perfect storm for both teams. 3) Does it happen? Probably not. I think the Hawks chase the dream till the end of Toews and Kaneās deals and then theyāll walk off into the sunset and the team could be mostly rebuilt that point. Instead weāre gonna have a failing team with 2 stars left thatās close but not close enough to the bottom. Iām just merely throwing out a scenario that I believe will benefit both teams and help with a quick rebuild. 4) We have assets that are wasting away here. I doubt thereās fans allowed back in this year anyways. Theyāre talking about a 4 city bubble scenario now. So it would probably be best to do this now. Because if they re-sign the duo in a few years, theyāre gonna have to overpay to get them to stay and the cap would be screwed for another 4-5 years. The dream is over. The sooner you admit that, the sooner you can come to grips that your jersey you spent a ton on is now a relic of the past. It is what it is. Mismanagement coupled with an aging team is what you see here. Youāll see more of the same with the inexperience behind the bench, and in the front office. Stan has now surrounded himself with all inexperienced guys in the office. Stan really has now experience in hockey besides what was given to him. Itās over!!! Everyone knows how I feel about the core but there's no longer any denying what you just said. I go on and on about playing K&T together but even their great career season together two years ago resulted in a 2 over season and a miss. When I first read your half retained idea last night(been up north),I wasn't crazy about it but it sounds better this morning. More business as usual will result in more no man's land,which is where we were pre-virus. Teams would line up for both Kane and Toews at half price with just three left and the return would be substantial. The Jets have been throwin' 1st rounders at rentals like Stastny and Hayes in search of a great #2 and three years of stability at the position would be huge for them. They could always send the 23yro Ehlers and his 6M back(we love Lil dudes) and they're tryin' to move Laine too so there'd be room. Patrick Kane might also enjoy furthering his legend in the big apple.
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Post by T-man2010 on Sept 25, 2020 11:01:09 GMT -6
Let's face the facts that this team is done as a PO contender year in year out. We are now at the 02-03 season for this team. Will take several years of drafts and a couple real miserable seasons followed by a #1 and #3 pick. To be relevant again.
We will need draft picks like the ones Smith and Pulford made from 02-03 to 04-05 Bolland, Crawford, Seabs, keith, Hammer, Buff......
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Post by vadarx on Sept 25, 2020 12:23:53 GMT -6
well geez, T, thanks for pissing in my Wheaties this afternoon..... š
I agree, it is obviously not working the way things are being done. treading water and picking in the teens each year isn't gonna help us. so, moving out some vets is probably the way to go. I personally don't see the necessity to move ALL of them out, but that's just my prerogative. I'd rather keep Toews around to mentor all these guys (provided he wanted to stay and do that) and move out Kane for a much larger haul and probably Keith at the deadline for another decent haul (I think we get more for him in season than we do in the offseason).
at the same time, I'd say you hit it on the head as far as what is going to happen. they are not going to trade any of the core, at least not just yet. the brass still believes that this team can make another run with these guys and are going to move guys like Maata and Saad out instead.
I was listening to one of the podcasts on nbcsn Chicago a week or so ago and they had Scott King on and they were discussing the state of the team and he was insistent that he thought they had another run left in them and all they needed to do was put the right pieces around em..... gotta think he was echoing the thoughts of the folks in charge (or just selling hope).....
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Post by BigT on Sept 25, 2020 12:47:42 GMT -6
well geez, T, thanks for pissing in my Wheaties this afternoon..... š I agree, it is obviously not working the way things are being done. treading water and picking in the teens each year isn't gonna help us. so, moving out some vets is probably the way to go. I personally don't see the necessity to move ALL of them out, but that's just my prerogative. I'd rather keep Toews around to mentor all these guys (provided he wanted to stay and do that) and move out Kane for a much larger haul and probably Keith at the deadline for another decent haul (I think we get more for him in season than we do in the offseason). at the same time, I'd say you hit it on the head as far as what is going to happen. they are not going to trade any of the core, at least not just yet. the brass still believes that this team can make another run with these guys and are going to move guys like Maata and Saad out instead. I was listening to one of the podcasts on nbcsn Chicago a week or so ago and they had Scoot King on and they were discussing the state of the team and he was insistent that he thought they had another run left in them and all they needed to do was put the right pieces around em..... gotta think he was echoing the thoughts of the folks in charge (or just selling hope)..... If they had another run in them, I think we would a seen something good outta them by now. Weāve seen nothing of the sort. The only only way it does work out, is if Dach becomes a F****** stud, and I mean a F****** stud. Boqvist becomes Lidstrom jr, Strome and Dcat become Hull and Oates. Mitchell is a rich mans Makar and Toews and Kane are the 2013 versions of themselves. I think maybe one or 2 of the scenarios pan out. And do they pan out in time for Toews and Kane? I just donāt see it happening, especially with the Greatest American Hero at the helm of this bitch. āBelieve it or not, heās walking on airā. Except itās just the hot air that came out of his orifices. He got to go, and he got to go NOW!!!
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Post by Deleted on Sept 25, 2020 13:32:35 GMT -6
well geez, T, thanks for pissing in my Wheaties this afternoon..... š I agree, it is obviously not working the way things are being done. treading water and picking in the teens each year isn't gonna help us. so, moving out some vets is probably the way to go. I personally don't see the necessity to move ALL of them out, but that's just my prerogative. I'd rather keep Toews around to mentor all these guys (provided he wanted to stay and do that) and move out Kane for a much larger haul and probably Keith at the deadline for another decent haul (I think we get more for him in season than we do in the offseason). at the same time, I'd say you hit it on the head as far as what is going to happen. they are not going to trade any of the core, at least not just yet. the brass still believes that this team can make another run with these guys and are going to move guys like Maata and Saad out instead. I was listening to one of the podcasts on nbcsn Chicago a week or so ago and they had Scoot King on and they were discussing the state of the team and he was insistent that he thought they had another run left in them and all they needed to do was put the right pieces around em..... gotta think he was echoing the thoughts of the folks in charge (or just selling hope)..... If they had another run in them, I think we would a seen something good outta them by now. Weāve seen nothing of the sort. The only only way it does work out, is if Dach becomes a F****** stud, and I mean a F****** stud. Boqvist becomes Lidstrom jr, Strome and Dcat become Hull and Oates. Mitchell is a rich mans Makar and Toews and Kane are the 2013 versions of themselves. I think maybe one or 2 of the scenarios pan out. And do they pan out in time for Toews and Kane? I just donāt see it happening, especially with the Greatest American Hero at the helm of this bitch. āBelieve it or not, heās walking on airā. Except itās just the hot air that came out of his orifices. He got to go, and he got to go NOW!!! Bowman Appropriate songs: Say it Ain't So, Out of Touch, I Can't Go For That, Possession Obsession, Promise Ain't Enough, It's a Laugh, Some Things Are Better Left Unsaid, Alone Too Long......
Oh, wait, HULL and Oates, I thought you said Hall & Oates. Well they certainly have a ton of song titles that fit Bowman to a tee!
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Post by vadarx on Sept 25, 2020 13:49:13 GMT -6
If they had another run in them, I think we would a seen something good outta them by now. Weāve seen nothing of the sort. The only only way it does work out, is if Dach becomes a F****** stud, and I mean a F****** stud. Boqvist becomes Lidstrom jr, Strome and Dcat become Hull and Oates. Mitchell is a rich mans Makar and Toews and Kane are the 2013 versions of themselves. I think maybe one or 2 of the scenarios pan out. And do they pan out in time for Toews and Kane? I just donāt see it happening, especially with the Greatest American Hero at the helm of this bitch. āBelieve it or not, heās walking on airā. Except itās just the hot air that came out of his orifices. He got to go, and he got to go NOW!!! Bowman Appropriate songs: Say it Ain't So, Out of Touch, I Can't Go For That, Possession Obsession, Promise Ain't Enough, It's a Laugh, Some Things Are Better Left Unsaid, Alone Too Long......
Oh, wait, HULL and Oates, I thought you said Hall & Oates. Well they certainly have a ton of song titles that fit Bowman to a tee!
š
that's the first thing I thought of too, phil!
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Post by vadarx on Sept 25, 2020 13:50:35 GMT -6
well geez, T, thanks for pissing in my Wheaties this afternoon..... š I agree, it is obviously not working the way things are being done. treading water and picking in the teens each year isn't gonna help us. so, moving out some vets is probably the way to go. I personally don't see the necessity to move ALL of them out, but that's just my prerogative. I'd rather keep Toews around to mentor all these guys (provided he wanted to stay and do that) and move out Kane for a much larger haul and probably Keith at the deadline for another decent haul (I think we get more for him in season than we do in the offseason). at the same time, I'd say you hit it on the head as far as what is going to happen. they are not going to trade any of the core, at least not just yet. the brass still believes that this team can make another run with these guys and are going to move guys like Maata and Saad out instead. I was listening to one of the podcasts on nbcsn Chicago a week or so ago and they had Scoot King on and they were discussing the state of the team and he was insistent that he thought they had another run left in them and all they needed to do was put the right pieces around em..... gotta think he was echoing the thoughts of the folks in charge (or just selling hope)..... If they had another run in them, I think we would a seen something good outta them by now. Weāve seen nothing of the sort. The only only way it does work out, is if Dach becomes a F****** stud, and I mean a F****** stud. Boqvist becomes Lidstrom jr, Strome and Dcat become Hull and Oates. Mitchell is a rich mans Makar and Toews and Kane are the 2013 versions of themselves. I think maybe one or 2 of the scenarios pan out. And do they pan out in time for Toews and Kane? I just donāt see it happening, especially with the Greatest American Hero at the helm of this bitch. āBelieve it or not, heās walking on airā. Except itās just the hot air that came out of his orifices. He got to go, and he got to go NOW!!! but we did see it, T! weren't you watching last month?! š
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Post by BigT on Sept 25, 2020 14:02:06 GMT -6
If they had another run in them, I think we would a seen something good outta them by now. Weāve seen nothing of the sort. The only only way it does work out, is if Dach becomes a F****** stud, and I mean a F****** stud. Boqvist becomes Lidstrom jr, Strome and Dcat become Hull and Oates. Mitchell is a rich mans Makar and Toews and Kane are the 2013 versions of themselves. I think maybe one or 2 of the scenarios pan out. And do they pan out in time for Toews and Kane? I just donāt see it happening, especially with the Greatest American Hero at the helm of this bitch. āBelieve it or not, heās walking on airā. Except itās just the hot air that came out of his orifices. He got to go, and he got to go NOW!!! but we did see it, T! weren't you watching last month?! š Ohh, I seen it. I seen them get beat up like a WAP in Brad Pitts harem!!!
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Post by hsbob on Sept 25, 2020 16:04:36 GMT -6
well geez, T, thanks for pissing in my Wheaties this afternoon..... š I agree, it is obviously not working the way things are being done. treading water and picking in the teens each year isn't gonna help us. so, moving out some vets is probably the way to go. I personally don't see the necessity to move ALL of them out, but that's just my prerogative. I'd rather keep Toews around to mentor all these guys (provided he wanted to stay and do that) and move out Kane for a much larger haul and probably Keith at the deadline for another decent haul (I think we get more for him in season than we do in the offseason). at the same time, I'd say you hit it on the head as far as what is going to happen. they are not going to trade any of the core, at least not just yet. the brass still believes that this team can make another run with these guys and are going to move guys like Maata and Saad out instead. I was listening to one of the podcasts on nbcsn Chicago a week or so ago and they had Scoot King on and they were discussing the state of the team and he was insistent that he thought they had another run left in them and all they needed to do was put the right pieces around em..... gotta think he was echoing the thoughts of the folks in charge (or just selling hope)..... If they had another run in them, I think we would a seen something good outta them by now. Weāve seen nothing of the sort. The only only way it does work out, is if Dach becomes a F****** stud, and I mean a F****** stud. Boqvist becomes Lidstrom jr, Strome and Dcat become Hull and Oates. Mitchell is a rich mans Makar and Toews and Kane are the 2013 versions of themselves. I think maybe one or 2 of the scenarios pan out. And do they pan out in time for Toews and Kane? I just donāt see it happening, especially with the Greatest American Hero at the helm of this bitch. āBelieve it or not, heās walking on airā. Except itās just the hot air that came out of his orifices. He got to go, and he got to go NOW!!! The 2013 version of themselves? We saw the 18-19 version and it was the best version ever for both but you know what...........we were two over and we missed. I still contend that Kane and Toews put up big numbers if left together but you know what.........we'd still dwell in the cellar. It looks like Dach's a good one but we don't know how good yet. Boqvist might be also but has to develop and develop in the NHL,not sure we have the staff to help him. Kubalik couldn't really look more suited to the NHL and with a scorer's mentality but does a big pay day affect his approach? Do D-Cat and Strome even have a future here,the HC doesn't like em or is just not good with young players. Did Nolander's 3rd coaching staff get through to him? He did see highs in gms and pts but he also saw time with our great forwards and just look how Kubalik took to playin' with JT! Nolander was scratched just three games in by his new coach,again in the team's biggest game in three years in favor of John Q and three more times in between to go along with diminished minutes at times also. The Lil Dudes to come,Mitchell and Beaudin might be pretty good too but we don't know that yet and I still don't see much from Rockford......maybe Kurashev. I agree with you as far as the NY approach of rebuilding being the proper one but things would be uglier than homemade shoes around here for a few years and the UC faithful will NOT go for that and the liquor salesmen know this so here we are............no man's land.
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Post by hsbob on Sept 25, 2020 16:14:55 GMT -6
well geez, T, thanks for pissing in my Wheaties this afternoon..... š I agree, it is obviously not working the way things are being done. treading water and picking in the teens each year isn't gonna help us. so, moving out some vets is probably the way to go. I personally don't see the necessity to move ALL of them out, but that's just my prerogative. I'd rather keep Toews around to mentor all these guys (provided he wanted to stay and do that) and move out Kane for a much larger haul and probably Keith at the deadline for another decent haul (I think we get more for him in season than we do in the offseason). at the same time, I'd say you hit it on the head as far as what is going to happen. they are not going to trade any of the core, at least not just yet. the brass still believes that this team can make another run with these guys and are going to move guys like Maata and Saad out instead. I was listening to one of the podcasts on nbcsn Chicago a week or so ago and they had Scott King on and they were discussing the state of the team and he was insistent that he thought they had another run left in them and all they needed to do was put the right pieces around em..... gotta think he was echoing the thoughts of the folks in charge (or just selling hope).....There's plenty of chatter like this around,92pts and a WC spot would take a lot of improvement for a team shedding salary IMO.... blackhawkup.com/2020/09/25/pre-draft-good-can-blackhawks-2020-21/
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Post by BigT on Sept 26, 2020 8:04:51 GMT -6
If they had another run in them, I think we would a seen something good outta them by now. Weāve seen nothing of the sort. The only only way it does work out, is if Dach becomes a F****** stud, and I mean a F****** stud. Boqvist becomes Lidstrom jr, Strome and Dcat become Hull and Oates. Mitchell is a rich mans Makar and Toews and Kane are the 2013 versions of themselves. I think maybe one or 2 of the scenarios pan out. And do they pan out in time for Toews and Kane? I just donāt see it happening, especially with the Greatest American Hero at the helm of this bitch. āBelieve it or not, heās walking on airā. Except itās just the hot air that came out of his orifices. He got to go, and he got to go NOW!!! The 2013 version of themselves? We saw the 18-19 version and it was the best version ever for both but you know what...........we were two over and we missed. I still contend that Kane and Toews put up big numbers if left together but you know what.........we'd still dwell in the cellar.Ā It looks like Dach's a good one but we don't know how good yet. Boqvist might be also but has to develop and develop in the NHL,not sure we have the staff to help him. Kubalik couldn't really look more suited to the NHL and with a scorer's mentality but does a big pay day affect his approach?Ā Do D-Cat and Strome even have a future here,the HC doesn't like em or is just not good with young players.Ā Did Nolander's 3rd coaching staff get through to him? He did see highs in gms and pts but he also saw time with our great forwards and just look how Kubalik took to playin' with JT! Nolander was scratched just three games in by his new coach,again in the team's biggest game in three years in favor of John Q and three more times in between to go along with diminished minutes at times also. The Lil Dudes to come,Mitchell and Beaudin might be pretty good too but we don't know that yet and I still don't see much from Rockford......maybe Kurashev.Ā I agree with you as far as the NY approach of rebuilding being the proper one but things would be uglier than homemade shoes around here for a few years and the UC faithful will NOT go for that and the liquor salesmen know this so here we are............no man's land.Ā Ā History is the beet teacher and I doubt this version of the Hawks is a Cup contender. Even if they sneak in for the next few years and get put out in the 1st round quite handily, Toews and Kane will be walking away or just not that great anymore (time waits for no man), we just donāt have the roster to compete or even have any help coming in the way of the farm. Iām on the side of the fence now to start over and get what you can while you can. It sucks horribly to watch a team decimated, but itās the right thing to do. After the 92 Hawks run, they chased the dream for another 5 years and that failed. Then the feeble rebuild attempts came for a decade. Then finally they had a GM wiling to take all the heat to get them on track. I believe itās easier to rebuild in the cap era. Teams are desperate to shed salary and teams can really pick up on that and take advantage. I think the turnaround could be 3-4 years and youāre back on top!!!
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Post by Deleted on Sept 26, 2020 11:06:01 GMT -6
The 2013 version of themselves? We saw the 18-19 version and it was the best version ever for both but you know what...........we were two over and we missed. I still contend that Kane and Toews put up big numbers if left together but you know what.........we'd still dwell in the cellar. It looks like Dach's a good one but we don't know how good yet. Boqvist might be also but has to develop and develop in the NHL,not sure we have the staff to help him. Kubalik couldn't really look more suited to the NHL and with a scorer's mentality but does a big pay day affect his approach? Do D-Cat and Strome even have a future here,the HC doesn't like em or is just not good with young players. Did Nolander's 3rd coaching staff get through to him? He did see highs in gms and pts but he also saw time with our great forwards and just look how Kubalik took to playin' with JT! Nolander was scratched just three games in by his new coach,again in the team's biggest game in three years in favor of John Q and three more times in between to go along with diminished minutes at times also. The Lil Dudes to come,Mitchell and Beaudin might be pretty good too but we don't know that yet and I still don't see much from Rockford......maybe Kurashev. I agree with you as far as the NY approach of rebuilding being the proper one but things would be uglier than homemade shoes around here for a few years and the UC faithful will NOT go for that and the liquor salesmen know this so here we are............no man's land. History is the beet teacher and I doubt this version of the Hawks is a Cup contender. Even if they sneak in for the next few years and get put out in the 1st round quite handily, Toews and Kane will be walking away or just not that great anymore (time waits for no man), we just donāt have the roster to compete or even have any help coming in the way of the farm. Iām on the side of the fence now to start over and get what you can while you can. It sucks horribly to watch a team decimated, but itās the right thing to do. After the 92 Hawks run, they chased the dream for another 5 years and that failed. Then the feeble rebuild attempts came for a decade. Then finally they had a GM wiling to take all the heat to get them on track. I believe itās easier to rebuild in the cap era. Teams are desperate to shed salary and teams can really pick up on that and take advantage. I think the turnaround could be 3-4 years and youāre back on top!!! And if rumors are true, 3 to 4 years is what Bowman has left on his contract with the Hawks. Don't like that "coincidence?" at all.
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Post by BigT on Sept 26, 2020 12:05:25 GMT -6
History is the beet teacher and I doubt this version of the Hawks is a Cup contender. Even if they sneak in for the next few years and get put out in the 1st round quite handily, Toews and Kane will be walking away or just not that great anymore (time waits for no man), we just donāt have the roster to compete or even have any help coming in the way of the farm. Iām on the side of the fence now to start over and get what you can while you can. It sucks horribly to watch a team decimated, but itās the right thing to do. After the 92 Hawks run, they chased the dream for another 5 years and that failed. Then the feeble rebuild attempts came for a decade. Then finally they had a GM wiling to take all the heat to get them on track. I believe itās easier to rebuild in the cap era. Teams are desperate to shed salary and teams can really pick up on that and take advantage. I think the turnaround could be 3-4 years and youāre back on top!!! And if rumors are true, 3 to 4 years is what Bowman has left on his contract with the Hawks. Don't like that "coincidence?" at all. Honestly Phill. I think he gets till the end of the Duos contract. Itās gonna be more of the same ole style you see now. Itās wrong, but at the same time, I donāt own the team, I donāt foot the bills. But what everyone knows is that Scambo is a fraud and he has zero clue what to do when it comes to the sport of ice hockey!!!
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Post by hsbob on Sept 26, 2020 17:06:07 GMT -6
And if rumors are true, 3 to 4 years is what Bowman has left on his contract with the Hawks. Don't like that "coincidence?" at all. Honestly Phill. I think he gets till the end of the Duos contract. Itās gonna be more of the same ole style you see now. Itās wrong, but at the same time, I donāt own the team, I donāt foot the bills. But what everyone knows is that Scambo is a fraud and he has zero clue what to do when it comes to the sport of ice hockey!!!But he has the liquor salesmen to council him on the fine points. I doubt there's any search for the new pres at all because the longer 'Prince Daniel' is on the throne,the longer he'll want to stay on the throne. When he speaks,he speaks of the new direction he wants the team to go and that doesn't sound like a placeholder to me. Even if there is an effort to find a new pres,who other than a yes man would take the position if the GM was just extended?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 26, 2020 17:49:13 GMT -6
Honestly Phill. I think he gets till the end of the Duos contract. Itās gonna be more of the same ole style you see now. Itās wrong, but at the same time, I donāt own the team, I donāt foot the bills. But what everyone knows is that Scambo is a fraud and he has zero clue what to do when it comes to the sport of ice hockey!!!But he has the liquor salesmen to council him on the fine points. I doubt there's any search for the new pres at all because the longer 'Prince Daniel' is on the throne,the longer he'll want to stay on the throne. When he speaks,he speaks of the new direction he wants the team to go and that doesn't sound like a placeholder to me. Even if there is an effort to find a new pres, who other than a yes man would take the position if the GM was just extended? Dale Tallon?
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Post by BigT on Sept 26, 2020 18:11:26 GMT -6
Honestly Phill. I think he gets till the end of the Duos contract. Itās gonna be more of the same ole style you see now. Itās wrong, but at the same time, I donāt own the team, I donāt foot the bills. But what everyone knows is that Scambo is a fraud and he has zero clue what to do when it comes to the sport of ice hockey!!!But he has the liquor salesmen to council him on the fine points. I doubt there's any search for the new pres at all because the longer 'Prince Daniel' is on the throne,the longer he'll want to stay on the throne. When he speaks,he speaks of the new direction he wants the team to go and that doesn't sound like a placeholder to me. Even if there is an effort to find a new pres,who other than a yes man would take the position if the GM was just extended? Ā Order takers are not needed in this sport. Gotta have some balls. Look at the move the Wings just made for Marc Staal. They got Staal and a 2021 2nd rounder for āfuture considerationsā. It was a salary dump. But the Rags didnāt break the bank, and the wings got a very useful player and a 2nd rounder. Yet our feeble minded simpleton with global mental delay has to give up a ton to move a contract!!!
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Post by vadarx on Sept 26, 2020 18:44:34 GMT -6
But he has the liquor salesmen to council him on the fine points. I doubt there's any search for the new pres at all because the longer 'Prince Daniel' is on the throne,the longer he'll want to stay on the throne. When he speaks,he speaks of the new direction he wants the team to go and that doesn't sound like a placeholder to me. Even if there is an effort to find a new pres,who other than a yes man would take the position if the GM was just extended? Ā Order takers are not needed in this sport. Gotta have some balls. Look at the move the Wings just made for Marc Staal. They got Staal and a 2021 2nd rounder for āfuture considerationsā. It was a salary dump. But the Rags didnāt break the bank, and the wings got a very useful player and a 2nd rounder. Yet our feeble minded simpleton with global mental delay has to give up a ton to move a contract!!! let's be clear: that was a good trade for the wangs cuz they got a 2nd for jack and shit, but Staal is not a very useful player. the wangs have kinda hinted like maybe they keep him, but chances are just as good that he is bought out..... worst thing about that trade is that is it made it quite clear that no way are we moving Seabrook this off-season now cuz it would probably cost us a first rounder to do so, and fuckkkk that.....
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Post by BigT on Sept 26, 2020 18:56:56 GMT -6
Order takers are not needed in this sport. Gotta have some balls. Look at the move the Wings just made for Marc Staal. They got Staal and a 2021 2nd rounder for āfuture considerationsā. It was a salary dump. But the Rags didnāt break the bank, and the wings got a very useful player and a 2nd rounder. Yet our feeble minded simpleton with global mental delay has to give up a ton to move a contract!!! let's be clear: that was a good trade for the wangs cuz they got a 2nd for jack and shit, but Staal is not a very useful player. the wangs have kinda hinted like maybe they keep him, but chances are just as good that he is bought out..... worst thing about that trade is that is it made it quite clear that no way are we moving Seabrook this off-season now cuz it would probably cost us a first rounder to do so, and fuckkkk that..... Staal has one year left at 5.7. I think they keep him. The Wings have the lower end of the cap right now. They will cash in big time if they use it properly. Vegas did the same thing coming into the existence. They took advantage of teams desperately trying to drop salary. I would love to see the Hawks take full advantage of a situation like this for the next few years and rebuild quickly. Itās not hard to retain half of our players salaries, especially when their replacement would be a rookie or cheaper player. The next few years a lot of teams will be cash strapped. The Hawks could take full advantage of this. But Iām sure Stan will sell this team as a playoff team. Then theyāll miss again, and heāll make a few more shitty moves and sell it again and theyāll miss again. Heāll add a few more kids, and miss again and say that the kids are just starting to catch stride and hopefully by then the ownership sees heās a liar and a fraud!!!
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Post by T-man2010 on Sept 26, 2020 19:14:32 GMT -6
Who will the Hawks sacrifice in the expansion draft?
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Post by vadarx on Sept 26, 2020 19:21:33 GMT -6
I don't think you can compare the situation in the d and Chicago, tbh. they are a few years ahead of us. tbh, considering how the 'hawks have tried to emulate them throughout the run, i expect we travel a similar path.....
for one thing, the wangs have a metric shit ton of cap space right now with more on the way after next season. they can afford to take on huge deals like that. I agree, they'd probably be smart to not buy him out, but from what I've read it'd only cost em a million next year in dead space, so maybe they do it. likely they don't, cuz they have a smart GM......
which brings me to my second difference and that is the fans there are all on board with the "Yzerplan". and why not, the guy is a helluva GM. that helps sell sucking to the public. the 'hawks don't really have that option.....
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Post by vadarx on Sept 26, 2020 19:22:29 GMT -6
Who will the Hawks sacrifice in the expansion draft? Seabrook.....š
wait, lemme rephrase.... Seabrook, a pick, and a prospect none of us here want to see traded.....
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Post by Tater on Sept 27, 2020 0:46:26 GMT -6
But he has the liquor salesmen to council him on the fine points. I doubt there's any search for the new pres at all because the longer 'Prince Daniel' is on the throne,the longer he'll want to stay on the throne. When he speaks,he speaks of the new direction he wants the team to go and that doesn't sound like a placeholder to me. Even if there is an effort to find a new pres,who other than a yes man would take the position if the GM was just extended? Exactly. With the trade deadline and draft so close, I doubt anything will be done. I fear they will stay with the current brass and doom the team for years.
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Post by BigT on Sept 27, 2020 6:41:21 GMT -6
1) The team is in a worse position than rebuilding. Look what the Rags did. They sent a letter out to their fans that theyāve had enough of trying to add fringe players and go for it when it was no longer possible. It is no longer possible here. Stan has traded away top players and brought in what he deems a fit. It hasnāt worked and it wonāt work. 2) The Rags are now in a good position to win. Theyāre gonna have Lafreniere cheap for 3 years. Kane conveniently has 3 years left. And if they get him at half price, Iād bet not just them, but a few other teams would give up a lot a more than Iāve said to get him. Also Kane and Panera were dyn O mite together and instead of waiting on Kakko to develop, they have Kane that can win in the 3 year window of Lafreniere. At the end of Lafrenieres ELC, heās gonna want 12-13 million, and they have Panera with that much. Itās a perfect storm for both teams. 3) Does it happen? Probably not. I think the Hawks chase the dream till the end of Toews and Kaneās deals and then theyāll walk off into the sunset and the team could be mostly rebuilt that point. Instead weāre gonna have a failing team with 2 stars left thatās close but not close enough to the bottom. Iām just merely throwing out a scenario that I believe will benefit both teams and help with a quick rebuild. 4) We have assets that are wasting away here. I doubt thereās fans allowed back in this year anyways. Theyāre talking about a 4 city bubble scenario now. So it would probably be best to do this now. Because if they re-sign the duo in a few years, theyāre gonna have to overpay to get them to stay and the cap would be screwed for another 4-5 years. The dream is over. The sooner you admit that, the sooner you can come to grips that your jersey you spent a ton on is now a relic of the past. It is what it is. Mismanagement coupled with an aging team is what you see here. Youāll see more of the same with the inexperience behind the bench, and in the front office. Stan has now surrounded himself with all inexperienced guys in the office. Stan really has now experience in hockey besides what was given to him. Itās over!!! Everyone knows how I feel about the core but there's no longer any denying what you just said. I go on and on about playing K&T together but even their great career season together two years ago resulted in a 2 over season and a miss.Ā Ā When I first read your half retained idea last night(been up north),I wasn't crazy about it but it sounds better this morning. More business as usual will result in more no man's land,which is where we were pre-virus. Teams would line up for both Kane and Toews at half price with just three left and the return would be substantial. The Jets have been throwin' 1st rounders at rentals like Stastny and Hayes in search of a great #2 and three years of stability at the position would be huge for them. They could always send the 23yro Ehlers and his 6M back(we love Lil dudes) and they're tryin' to move Laine too so there'd be room. Patrick Kane might also enjoy furthering his legend in the big apple.Ā Ā Letās say the Jets were to send Laine for Toews with the same amount retained so the money is a wash, would that be an acceptable trade? A young sniper thatās huge and could slide in a top line with Dach? Iād think about that one very hard. Then if we did that Kane deal with the Rags, and the deal with Van to acquire Loui Ericksson and get Podkolzin out of the deal. Weād have a very big and skilled team to move forward. Imagine having 1)Kakko-Dach-Laine 2) Dcat-Strome-Podkolzin. That could be an electric top two lines in years to come. All are under 24 and it gives us years to build around and keep salaries under control. I think Iād feel much better about that, plus we could also get a couple more good players out of the draft as weād be on the bottom to start out. Iād also try and get Byram for Saad half price from the Avs. Canāt have too many d men. Also like Iāve said, Iād honestly keep Seabs as my captain and let him help out with the kids. He said he loves having Dach around and mentoring the young kids in the room. Heād probably appreciate being captain, and more than likely only play a couple more years before he retired anyways. At that point the team would be in prime position to take off. We would also have a couple top 3 picks as the team would suffer the first two years. But then theyād take flight in the 3rd year, and maybe just maybe, bring back Toews and Kane to hell with the Cup when their current deals run out and let them relive their glory and get us to where we need. By then, Kane will be poised to become the highest scoring American born of all time, and be the highest scoring American born of all time in the post season. Itās a win win across the board!!!
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Post by hsbob on Sept 27, 2020 8:47:46 GMT -6
Everyone knows how I feel about the core but there's no longer any denying what you just said. I go on and on about playing K&T together but even their great career season together two years ago resulted in a 2 over season and a miss. When I first read your half retained idea last night(been up north),I wasn't crazy about it but it sounds better this morning. More business as usual will result in more no man's land,which is where we were pre-virus. Teams would line up for both Kane and Toews at half price with just three left and the return would be substantial. The Jets have been throwin' 1st rounders at rentals like Stastny and Hayes in search of a great #2 and three years of stability at the position would be huge for them. They could always send the 23yro Ehlers and his 6M back(we love Lil dudes) and they're tryin' to move Laine too so there'd be room. Patrick Kane might also enjoy furthering his legend in the big apple. Letās say the Jets were to send Laine for Toews with the same amount retained so the money is a wash, would that be an acceptable trade? A young sniper thatās huge and could slide in a top line with Dach? Iād think about that one very hard. Then if we did that Kane deal with the Rags, and the deal with Van to acquire Loui Ericksson and get Podkolzin out of the deal. Weād have a very big and skilled team to move forward. Imagine having 1)Kakko-Dach-Laine 2) Dcat-Strome-Podkolzin. That could be an electric top two lines in years to come. All are under 24 and it gives us years to build around and keep salaries under control. I think Iād feel much better about that, plus we could also get a couple more good players out of the draft as weād be on the bottom to start out. Iād also try and get Byram for Saad half price from the Avs. Canāt have too many d men. Also like Iāve said, Iād honestly keep Seabs as my captain and let him help out with the kids. He said he loves having Dach around and mentoring the young kids in the room. Heād probably appreciate being captain, and more than likely only play a couple more years before he retired anyways. At that point the team would be in prime position to take off. We would also have a couple top 3 picks as the team would suffer the first two years. But then theyād take flight in the 3rd year, and maybe just maybe, bring back Toews and Kane to hell with the Cup when their current deals run out and let them relive their glory and get us to where we need. By then, Kane will be poised to become the highest scoring American born of all time, and be the highest scoring American born of all time in the post season. Itās a win win across the board!!! Laine would make sense and a flat cap might allow a reasonable extension unless he blows the stat sheet up(which could happen on a line with Kane if he stays) and if he wants too much at that point,you trade him for a MASSIVE return at the TDL. My concern with a Jets trade is Scambo might opt for Lil' Nik Ehlers instead and his 6M for the next five years........gotta be first to the puck.......so you can get plastered!LOL! Maybe the Seabs idea works cause Dach did get bigger and stronger as the year went on livin' in Mrs. Seabs basement and few rookies do that. I'd do the Saad trade too,a D prospect with size who looks ready is a need. I'd love to see the team "take off again",I waited a long time last time but what are the chances the Org has ANY intention of doing anything other than portray themselves as a PO team again? I just don't see ownership trading K&T risking the half empty UC we saw last time the team was real bad.........to quote 'Dollar Bill',"who'll buy my beer?"
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