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cnyfan
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Post by cnyfan on Mar 5, 2021 14:53:19 GMT -6
Seabs was one of my favorites and I will miss watching him play. Thanks for the above article. All of it so true. All the best to our best warrior!
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Post by BigT on Mar 5, 2021 15:32:20 GMT -6
Great article buddy. Thanks for that. I guess that was my realization that the era has come to an end. It’s quite sobering, even if I’ve gotten into the wine already!!! |
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Post by vadarx on Mar 5, 2021 16:15:39 GMT -6
what a fucking bummer to wake up to, but one we all knew was coming. my second favorite player of all time, a great guy and a great teammate. what a career, we already all miss ya Seabs!
the greatest player to wear #7 ever for the Chicago Blackhawks and I look forward to seeing his number being raised to the rafters in the future.
and, personally, thank you so very much for this (above)!
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Post by T-man2010 on Mar 5, 2021 16:36:54 GMT -6
Now I'll have to wear my Seabrook sweater for the game tonight.
I hope they wait to have the appreciation night when the crowds are back.
Some tissues might be required.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 5, 2021 17:26:38 GMT -6
Great article buddy. Thanks for that. I guess that was my realization that the era has come to an end. It’s quite sobering, even if I’ve gotten into the wine already!!! Truly amazing how long it takes to build a dynasty and how quickly it all comes crashing down. Less than 1 year after winning the 2015 Cup they couldn't get out of the first round of the playoffs and that's as close as they've come ever since. As Rozner said, in 6 years since the last Cup of the "Magnificent 7" now 3 are retired, one is in Arizona, one is MIA and may soon retire as well and only 2 are left playing for the Blackhawks. Makes you happy you lived through all the great moments and sad they are gone. Also, as I reflect back, makes me regret how upset/angry I'd get over losses instead of just buckling up and enjoying the ride more. |
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Post by galaxytrash on Mar 5, 2021 18:08:59 GMT -6
edzo going to interview seabrook in the first intermission tonight.
wow. so many tributes on twitter from a whole range of people, i could easily put 50 here.
anyways, his numbers speak for themselves.
2137 hits since 05/06 leads team. 2nd was bickell at 814.
1998 blocked shots led the team.
1162 games with 21:56 average time on ice. all these numbers amount to a ton of clicks on the clock, his mind was willing but unfortunately his body wasn't.
3 o/t goals in the playoffs second only to kane's 5.
123 games, 24:52 average time on ice second only to DK's 28:00.
enjoy your retirement seabs. i'd say you earned it.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 5, 2021 18:20:01 GMT -6
Great article buddy. Thanks for that. I guess that was my realization that the era has come to an end. It’s quite sobering, even if I’ve gotten into the wine already!!!  |
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Post by vadarx on Mar 5, 2021 18:24:06 GMT -6
edzo going to interview seabrook in the first intermission tonight. wow. so many tributes on twitter from a whole range of people, i could easily put 50 here. anyways, his numbers speak for themselves. 2137 hits since 05/05 leads team. 2nd was bickell at 814. 1998 blocked shots led the team. 1162 games with 21:56 average time on ice. all these numbers amount to a ton of clicks on the clock, his mind was willing but unfortunately his body wasn't. 3 o/t goals in the playoffs second only to kane's 5. 123 games, 24:52 average time on ice second only to DK's 28:00. enjoy your retirement seabs. i'd say you earned it. gotta work it again tonight. if you could post that interview here, it would be greatly appreciated. I'll do my best not to get misty while on the clock..... |
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Post by galaxytrash on Mar 5, 2021 18:29:50 GMT -6
edzo going to interview seabrook in the first intermission tonight. wow. so many tributes on twitter from a whole range of people, i could easily put 50 here. anyways, his numbers speak for themselves. 2137 hits since 05/05 leads team. 2nd was bickell at 814. 1998 blocked shots led the team. 1162 games with 21:56 average time on ice. all these numbers amount to a ton of clicks on the clock, his mind was willing but unfortunately his body wasn't. 3 o/t goals in the playoffs second only to kane's 5. 123 games, 24:52 average time on ice second only to DK's 28:00. enjoy your retirement seabs. i'd say you earned it. gotta work it again tonight. if you could post that interview here, it would be greatly appreciated. I'll do my best not to get misty while on the clock..... there's this one which you likely saw. i haven't watched it yet, but i will after the game. www.nhl.com/blackhawks/video/seabrook-reflects-on-15-seasons/t-277437096/c-7713509and if i can get edzo's interview i'll plunk it here. |
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Post by vadarx on Mar 5, 2021 18:31:02 GMT -6
Now I'll have to wear my Seabrook sweater for the game tonight. I hope they wait to have the appreciation night when the crowds are back. Some tissues might be required. I am an owner of many Blackhawks sweaters. I've been to many games in said sweaters. since game 7 vs the wangs in 2013, I've only worn my home Reebok #7, no letter as it was that night in May almost 8 years ago... went to Vancouver for a game last January. as we walked to the arena, a couple guys in front of us were giving a couple 'hawks fans a hard time, both had Kane jerseys on. as we pulled even with them, one of them turns and looks at me and looks at my sweater and says " Seabrook? OK, you gotta respect that...." |
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Post by vadarx on Mar 5, 2021 18:34:36 GMT -6
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Post by galaxytrash on Mar 5, 2021 20:10:01 GMT -6
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Post by galaxytrash on Mar 5, 2021 20:35:15 GMT -6
not so surprised keith and seabs top this list, but a bit surprised by how much.
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Post by galaxytrash on Mar 5, 2021 22:26:04 GMT -6
put these in the GDT but may as well plunk them here for posterity.
like the little salute from 2 to 7 there near the end.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 5, 2021 22:33:33 GMT -6
watching a lot of videos and tributes today gotta say this one stings more than hossa or sharp
maybe cause he was drafted by the team and spent entire career here, not sure the exact reason
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Post by tincup on Mar 5, 2021 23:10:54 GMT -6
not so surprised keith and seabs top this list, but a bit surprised by how much. Lasted longer than some marriages and going by my in-laws, probably the same amount of intimacy. |
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Post by vadarx on Mar 5, 2021 23:40:01 GMT -6
watching a lot of videos and tributes today gotta say this one stings more than hossa or sharp maybe cause he was drafted by the team and spent entire career here, not sure the exact reason right there with ya, merp. he is right near the top of the list as far as personal favorites go for me, for a bunch of reasons (not just that he FINALLY vanquished the wangs). he wasn't a "star", although he did play in an all star game and the 2010 Olympics. he wasn't a guy that wins awards. he wasn't a guy that first came to mind during the heyday. he didn't need a letter to be a leader. he went out there and worked. he gave it his all, all the time, every time. can't throw a football, but I'll lace em up cuz I have to. can't tie my own shoes, but I'm gonna be on the ice cuz my teammates need me..... not a big talker unless needed. because of that, when he had something to say, folks stfu and listened. not the most outgoing guy, but once he got to know ya a little, a super nice guy. and a super teammate. we also have the same birthday.....lol. very happy the boys won for him tonight! edit: just wanted to add in here that when I said he wasn't the most outgoing, I meant that in regards to folks outside of the locker room/rink. in there, he was absolutely a guy who got to know and made the new guys/rookies comfortable. |
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Post by hsbob on Mar 6, 2021 9:08:45 GMT -6
I just noticed CF has him on LTIR which he wasn't on till now,this really isn't a retirement then or I don't understand the rules. Also they have moved Shaw and Smith to LTIR. They no longer show a IR list. Wonder what brought all this on,there's been no news and then everything on the same day.........move coming? |
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Post by hsbob on Mar 6, 2021 9:14:13 GMT -6
Too bad for Seabrook. He was a great player and leader. OK, here is where I need all you smart guys on this website. I read that he will go on LTIR, even though he retired. So, can someone please explain for an idiot, like myself, what is the effect of his status on the salary cap for this year and the rest of his contract? Is there some means by which his scheduled salary will simply come off the books at some point? Thanks for taking the time to explain it to a moron. The bane of your existence has retired jack........did you sleep better last night? |
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Post by T-man2010 on Mar 6, 2021 9:18:58 GMT -6
How many guys woulda milked the LTIR route for every penny due them? What a massive favor Seabs did his team and what a break for SB.....with Seabs' deal gone,it should be up and away I'm told. More room to pay de HAAN 4.55M again next year........right? As I gathered from the press releases and his video, he is going to stay on LTIR for the remainder of his contract and get paid. Similar to what they did with Hossa. He got paid even though he was traded to AZ. Yotes needed the contract to hit the floor level. So to me that's a good thing the Hawks are doing for Seabs the next 3 years. He will not lose out on money. That also won't affect Wirtz pocket at all, just the cap on the first day of the season then LTIR him. They probably also have insurance for such issues so some of the contract will be paid by insurance. |
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Post by hsbob on Mar 6, 2021 9:19:18 GMT -6
I’ve said this before. It’s not the most popular. But I’m on record saying Seabs would never see the end of this contract, and he’d do the Hawks a favour and they’d somehow compensate him. I’d bet he gets a job working for the Hawks for a nice salary. Then I’d bet his contract had insurance on it and if he has to retire do to injury, he gets 1/3 of it. And the Hawks will somehow compensate him for the rest!!! I wouldn't be surprised, but I think that the 'hawks have to somehow avoid the image that they got Seabrook to retire and gave him a job that pays him approximately the same as merely a means to circumvent the cap. Even if it's not strictly dictated in the CBA, the league can choose to make an example of it--like Kovalchuk. Since Seabrook's deal is not a recapture-risk, I think there would be interest from the league proper to not have a loophole be exploited for circumventing cap. I'm not saying it can't be done, but given the state of the 'hawks if they play this fast and loose and the league decides to make us an example, it can suck for the rebuild. I'm thinkin' Seabs and the Org came up with an amicable deal,retire now and we'll put you on LTIR and pay you for the rest of the season,I doubt the deal goes any further.......or it isn't retirement. |
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Post by hsbob on Mar 6, 2021 9:29:52 GMT -6
How many guys woulda milked the LTIR route for every penny due them? What a massive favor Seabs did his team and what a break for SB.....with Seabs' deal gone,it should be up and away I'm told. More room to pay de HAAN 4.55M again next year........right? As I gathered from the press releases and his video, he is going to stay on LTIR for the remainder of his contract and get paid. Similar to what they did with Hossa. He got paid even though he was traded to AZ. Yotes needed the contract to hit the floor level. So to me that's a good thing the Hawks are doing for Seabs the next 3 years. He will not lose out on money. That also won't affect Wirtz pocket at all, just the cap on the first day of the season then LTIR him. They probably also have insurance for such issues so some of the contract will be paid by insurance. Just read your post before posting mine and good for Seabs if true. I just don't understand how a non-recapture deal(Hossa's was recapture)continues to pay a player who openly announces retirement. I thought a player would have to go through the motions of at least giving it a go in camp in order to get the LTIR relief but I'm happy for all involved that it isn't the case. The insured contract factor is an interesting one and makes sense if true. Not having that 6.8M in space until a game in the next two years could be a huge factor in offseason deals too. |
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Post by T-man2010 on Mar 6, 2021 9:32:23 GMT -6
As I gathered from the press releases and his video, he is going to stay on LTIR for the remainder of his contract and get paid. Similar to what they did with Hossa. He got paid even though he was traded to AZ. Yotes needed the contract to hit the floor level. So to me that's a good thing the Hawks are doing for Seabs the next 3 years. He will not lose out on money. That also won't affect Wirtz pocket at all, just the cap on the first day of the season then LTIR him. They probably also have insurance for such issues so some of the contract will be paid by insurance. Just read your post before posting mine and good for Seabs if true. I just don't understand how a non-recapture deal(Hossa's was recapture)continues to pay a player who openly announces retirement. I thought a player would have to go through the motions of at least giving it a go in camp in order to get the LTIR relief but I'm happy for all involved that it isn't the case. The insured contract factor is an interesting one and makes sense if true. Not having that 6.8M in space until a game in the next two years could be a huge factor in offseason deals too. Yep, there they will have to do some contract juggling to start the season. |
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Post by jacksalmon on Mar 6, 2021 10:20:33 GMT -6
Too bad for Seabrook. He was a great player and leader. OK, here is where I need all you smart guys on this website. I read that he will go on LTIR, even though he retired. So, can someone please explain for an idiot, like myself, what is the effect of his status on the salary cap for this year and the rest of his contract? Is there some means by which his scheduled salary will simply come off the books at some point? Thanks for taking the time to explain it to a moron The bane of your existence has retired jack........did you sleep better last night? Bob, Bob, Bob-----I thought we agreed it was a bad contract. You because of the NMC and the term/amount and me because it was given at all. But, I never said that Seabrook was not great in his prime. I did say he slowed down after that. What transpired was one of the reasons I was against his contract in the first place. But, as I have written a few times, I guess we simply disagreed on this one. I think it is a little unfair for you to suggest that I did not think much of Seabrook as a player because I believed that the Hawks could not afford his contract in the salary cap era. I always took the position that someone had to be jettisoned in that situation and since it was not going to be Kane or Toews (rightfully so), it had to be Seabrook. But, that did not mean I did not think highly of what he accomplished and his play. But, to answer your question, I did not sleep better last night. That was because no one explained in simple terms, that an idiot like myself could understand, what is the effect on the Hawk salary cap? I think he has three or four years left on his contract at $6.8 per year. Has he retired or will he simply on LTIR for the rest of this year/his full contract? There are some hocus pocus calculations about replacing him if he is on LTIR and different ones, if he has simply retired. If he is LTIR, I guess he is entitled to every dollar of his contract and every dollar counts against the cap, I guess except for those calcs regarding what is paid to his replacement. If he has truly retired, I don't know what happens, but why would he give up the money he is due. Now, if you could simply explain what is the effect of whatever it is that he did on the salary cap, I might be able to sleep better tonight, knowing that was is done is done, but the future regarding his cap effect is brighter; or still have insomnia because it isn't. I will thank you ahead of time for your effort in helping me sleep. |
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Post by jacksalmon on Mar 6, 2021 10:27:53 GMT -6
How many guys woulda milked the LTIR route for every penny due them? What a massive favor Seabs did his team and what a break for SB.....with Seabs' deal gone,it should be up and away I'm told. More room to pay de HAAN 4.55M again next year........right? As I gathered from the press releases and his video, he is going to stay on LTIR for the remainder of his contract and get paid. Similar to what they did with Hossa. He got paid even though he was traded to AZ. Yotes needed the contract to hit the floor level. So to me that's a good thing the Hawks are doing for Seabs the next 3 years. He will not lose out on money. That also won't affect Wirtz pocket at all, just the cap on the first day of the season then LTIR him. They probably also have insurance for such issues so some of the contract will be paid by insurance. Since you apparently understand this stuff much better than I do, I'll fire some of my questions at you. What happened with Hossa? Was he traded to Arizona, but the Hawks kept the responsibility to pay his contract? Did the money they paid Hossa count against the Hawk salary cap; or because he was technically a Yote, it did not even though the Hawks were really the team paying him? So, if Seabrook stays on LTIR for the length of his remaining contract years, would the Hawks also have to trade him and pay his salary like they did with Hossa, if that is what happened, in order to not have the money paid him count against the cap? Or do some different rules apply to Seabrook that did not apply to Hossa? Bottom line, is there a way to pay Seabrook out for his contract length, but not have it count against the cap? If so, does it have to involve a trade, or is there another way to do it? |
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Post by hsbob on Mar 6, 2021 10:56:53 GMT -6
The bane of your existence has retired jack........did you sleep better last night? Bob, Bob, Bob-----I thought we agreed it was a bad contract. You because of the NMC and the term/amount and me because it was given at all. But, I never said that Seabrook was not great in his prime. I did say he slowed down after that. What transpired was one of the reasons I was against his contract in the first place. But, as I have a few times, I guess we simply disagreed on this one. I think it is a little unfair for you to suggest that I did not think much of Seabrook as a player because I believed that the Hawks could not afford his contract in the salary cap era. I always took the position that someone had to be jettisoned in that situation and since it was not going to be Kane or Toews (rightfully so), it had to be Seabrook. But, that did not mean I did not think highly of what he accomplished and his play. But, to answer your question, I did not sleep better last night. That was because no one explained in simple terms, that an idiot like myself could understand, what is the effect on the Hawk salary cap? I think he has three or four years left on his contract at $6.8 per year. Has he retired or will he simply on LTIR for the rest of this year/his full contract? There are some hocus pocus calculations about replacing him if he is on LTIR and different ones, if he has simply retired. If he is LTIR, I guess he is entitled to every dollar of his contract and every dollar counts against the cap, I guess except for those calcs regarding what is paid to his replacement. If he has truly retired, I don't know what happens, but why would he give up the money he is due. Now, if you could simply explain what is the effect of whatever it is that he did on the salary cap, I might be able to sleep better tonight, knowing that was is done is done, but the future regarding his cap effect is brighter; or still have insomnia because it isn't. I will thank you ahead of time for your effort in helping me sleep. 'My doctor gave me sleeping pills......he told me to take two every time I woke up'.....LOL! Didn't mean to insinuate you didn't appreciate Seabs as a player years back but you have pointed to his deal and his only as the root of all evil as far as signing and/or keeping players even though I've pointed out all the other wasted money. To be honest,I don't understand putting a player on LTIR who wasn't already on LTIR immediately after announcing his retirement any better than you do and stop saying you don't understand this or that because you're an idiot or a moron........you're no more an idiot or a moron than I am......if that helps!LOL! |
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Post by T-man2010 on Mar 6, 2021 11:07:47 GMT -6
As I gathered from the press releases and his video, he is going to stay on LTIR for the remainder of his contract and get paid. Similar to what they did with Hossa. He got paid even though he was traded to AZ. Yotes needed the contract to hit the floor level. So to me that's a good thing the Hawks are doing for Seabs the next 3 years. He will not lose out on money. That also won't affect Wirtz pocket at all, just the cap on the first day of the season then LTIR him. They probably also have insurance for such issues so some of the contract will be paid by insurance. Since you apparently understand this stuff much better than I do, I'll fire some of my questions at you. What happened with Hossa? Was he traded to Arizona, but the Hawks kept the responsibility to pay his contract? Did the money they paid Hossa count against the Hawk salary cap; or because he was technically a Yote, it did not even though the Hawks were really the team paying him? So, if Seabrook stays on LTIR for the length of his remaining contract years, would the Hawks also have to trade him and pay his salary like they did with Hossa, if that is what happened, in order to not have the money paid him count against the cap? Or do some different rules apply to Seabrook that did not apply to Hossa? Bottom line, is there a way to pay Seabrook out for his contract length, but not have it count against the cap? If so, does it have to involve a trade, or is there another way to do it? As best as I can understand without being a "capologist" was Hossa's contract was front end loaded. The last years were a million dollars a year even though it was 6+ mill in cap space. Now Seabs is not as drastic as Hossa's was. Seabs will get 5 mill this year, then 6 mill, 5 mill and 4.5 mill the next 3 years. Cap is still 6.8+ each year. The Yotes took Hossa's contract, along with Datsyuk and Pronger's to reach the cap floor level. But we also had to trade some good minor prospects to make it work for them. |
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Post by hsbob on Mar 6, 2021 11:12:19 GMT -6
As I gathered from the press releases and his video, he is going to stay on LTIR for the remainder of his contract and get paid. Similar to what they did with Hossa. He got paid even though he was traded to AZ. Yotes needed the contract to hit the floor level. So to me that's a good thing the Hawks are doing for Seabs the next 3 years. He will not lose out on money. That also won't affect Wirtz pocket at all, just the cap on the first day of the season then LTIR him. They probably also have insurance for such issues so some of the contract will be paid by insurance. Since you apparently understand this stuff much better than I do, I'll fire some of my questions at you. What happened with Hossa? Was he traded to Arizona, but the Hawks kept the responsibility to pay his contract? Did the money they paid Hossa count against the Hawk salary cap; or because he was technically a Yote, it did not even though the Hawks were really the team paying him? So, if Seabrook stays on LTIR for the length of his remaining contract years, would the Hawks also have to trade him and pay his salary like they did with Hossa, if that is what happened, in order to not have the money paid him count against the cap? Or do some different rules apply to Seabrook that did not apply to Hossa? Bottom line, is there a way to pay Seabrook out for his contract length, but not have it count against the cap? If so, does it have to involve a trade, or is there another way to do it? I know you're not asking me but you pose the same questions I have jack. Hossa was a recapture contract who HAD to go the LTIR route with the medical condition since a retirement announcement woulda been awful for the Hawks cap-wise and yes the Yotes just took the hit to get to the cap floor and I believe the Yotes paid Hossa the 1M due him in order to have his 5.5M cap hit on THEIR books to reach the aforementioned cap floor.......even though everyone knew he'd neve suit up again. I don't recall another non-recapture player with this much money still due them retiring so it's unusual and I can't say if it's good with the league either after this year. I just don't see how any team can keep a player who publicly announced his retirement on LTIR past this year but I'm happy the situation is good for all involved and seems to have been handled as well as it could have been......this hasn't always been the case in the past. |
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Post by jacksalmon on Mar 6, 2021 11:14:16 GMT -6
Bob, Bob, Bob-----I thought we agreed it was a bad contract. You because of the NMC and the term/amount and me because it was given at all. But, I never said that Seabrook was not great in his prime. I did say he slowed down after that. What transpired was one of the reasons I was against his contract in the first place. But, as I have a few times, I guess we simply disagreed on this one. I think it is a little unfair for you to suggest that I did not think much of Seabrook as a player because I believed that the Hawks could not afford his contract in the salary cap era. I always took the position that someone had to be jettisoned in that situation and since it was not going to be Kane or Toews (rightfully so), it had to be Seabrook. But, that did not mean I did not think highly of what he accomplished and his play. But, to answer your question, I did not sleep better last night. That was because no one explained in simple terms, that an idiot like myself could understand, what is the effect on the Hawk salary cap? I think he has three or four years left on his contract at $6.8 per year. Has he retired or will he simply on LTIR for the rest of this year/his full contract? There are some hocus pocus calculations about replacing him if he is on LTIR and different ones, if he has simply retired. If he is LTIR, I guess he is entitled to every dollar of his contract and every dollar counts against the cap, I guess except for those calcs regarding what is paid to his replacement. If he has truly retired, I don't know what happens, but why would he give up the money he is due. Now, if you could simply explain what is the effect of whatever it is that he did on the salary cap, I might be able to sleep better tonight, knowing that was is done is done, but the future regarding his cap effect is brighter; or still have insomnia because it isn't. I will thank you ahead of time for your effort in helping me sleep. 'My doctor gave me sleeping pills......he told me to take two every time I woke up'.....LOL! Didn't mean to insinuate you didn't appreciate Seabs as a player years back but you have pointed to his deal and his only as the root of all evil as far as signing and/or keeping players even though I've pointed out all the other wasted money. To be honest,I don't understand putting a player on LTIR who wasn't already on LTIR immediately after announcing his retirement any better than you do and stop saying you don't understand this or that because you're an idiot or a moron........you're no more an idiot or a moron than I am......if that helps!LOL! Just to be accurate, I have mentioned Seabrook's contract as a big problem many times, as you well know. You correctly then brought up other bad contracts (DeHaan's being the prime focus) and after reading your thinking, I completely agreed with you. The only difference in our thinking is that I saw a difference between making a bad choice when selecting a new player for a signing, or trade, and resigning a player when up against a salary cap problem that would only make the salary cap problem worse. But, you can say it ain't much of a difference and who is to say that the Seabrook signing would never have worked out. I suppose we could go round and round on that one and we have. But, I do agree with you that other money was unwisely spent with regard to non-Seabrook contracts. Well, now we know there are two of us idiots when it comes to the salary cap effect of whatever it is that Seabrook did. But, before, I responded here I saw that T-Man had responded to my plea for info on this situation, so I am now off to read his post to see if I can be enlightened. |
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Post by jacksalmon on Mar 6, 2021 11:17:44 GMT -6
T-Man and Bob: Good try, boys, but I still don't get it. What is the bottom line effect on the Hawks' salary cap this year and for the next three, given whatever it is that Seabrook did? Will every penny they pay Seabrook count against the cap; or will some, or all of it, not count? I don't need to know why. I just would like to know what is the bottom line effect.
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