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Post by galaxytrash on Apr 13, 2023 16:54:34 GMT -6
seen some discussion on ticket prices so thought i'd drop this here.
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Post by Nikos on Apr 13, 2023 17:52:59 GMT -6
If KD does not have much success in the next couple of years and is replaced his legacy will be the one that got rid of Toews and Kane. Might not be fair but that will the consensus I believe.
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Post by BigT on Apr 13, 2023 18:19:51 GMT -6
If KD does not have much success in the next couple of years and is replaced his legacy will be the one that got rid of Toews and Kane. Might not be fair but that will the consensus I believe. I’m not gonna get right into it. I just won’t. But I’ve said over the past year or so, that the org wanted everyone from the Beach fiasco out. All of them. Rockwell basically said that when he laid into Phillip Thompson when he asked a question at the Hawks conference they had. I believe this was the plan all along. They only hired KD to rid themselves of everyone from that era. It apparently cost Rocky over 60 million. He’s not happy. And that was just Beach. The other kid from Michigan got something near 10. So Rockwell wasn’t happy. That’s all I’ll say about that. KD was hired to do the impossible. He’s done that. I do not believe he’ll be here past the emergence of this team. His successor is already planning his death underneath him!!! |
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Post by vadarx on Apr 13, 2023 18:19:52 GMT -6
If KD does not have much success in the next couple of years and is replaced his legacy will be the one that got rid of Toews and Kane. Might not be fair but that will the consensus I believe. that's exactly what he is getting paid to do, so... |
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Post by hsbob on Apr 13, 2023 22:23:51 GMT -6
If KD does not have much success in the next couple of years and is replaced his legacy will be the one that got rid of Toews and Kane. Might not be fair but that will the consensus I believe. I’m not gonna get right into it. I just won’t. But I’ve said over the past year or so, that the org wanted everyone from the Beach fiasco out. All of them. Rockwell basically said that when he laid into Phillip Thompson when he asked a question at the Hawks conference they had. I believe this was the plan all along. They only hired KD to rid themselves of everyone from that era. It apparently cost Rocky over 60 million. He’s not happy. And that was just Beach. The other kid from Michigan got something near 10. So Rockwell wasn’t happy. That’s all I’ll say about that. KD was hired to do the impossible. He’s done that. I do not believe he’ll be here past the emergence of this team. His successor is already planning his death underneath him!!! The stench of the scandal is no more on Patrick Kane or Jonathan Toews than it is on Rocky Wirtz........no matter how much he lies! Sharp remains in the booth and the team expressed interest in Hossa returning in some capacity..........no stench on those guys either? Do the impossible? Wasn't impossible for Vegas or Seattle. What's he "done" so far but prove he could trade the most sought after players on the team? He did get a good amount of picks in return for those sought after players he inherited but you're counting a whole barn-yard full of chickens before a single one's hatched. Will it be chicken salad or chicken shit when they do hatch? Remember that one? |
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Post by bigbarn27 on Apr 13, 2023 23:57:12 GMT -6
If KD does not have much success in the next couple of years and is replaced his legacy will be the one that got rid of Toews and Kane. Might not be fair but that will the consensus I believe. I’m not gonna get right into it. I just won’t. But I’ve said over the past year or so, that the org wanted everyone from the Beach fiasco out. All of them. Rockwell basically said that when he laid into Phillip Thompson when he asked a question at the Hawks conference they had. I believe this was the plan all along. They only hired KD to rid themselves of everyone from that era. It apparently cost Rocky over 60 million. He’s not happy. And that was just Beach. The other kid from Michigan got something near 10. So Rockwell wasn’t happy. That’s all I’ll say about that. KD was hired to do the impossible. He’s done that. I do not believe he’ll be here past the emergence of this team. His successor is already planning his death underneath him!!! Rocky makes about 50 mil a year Wirtz corp is worth close to 6 bill. This is a tax write off did not hurt them at all. I believe he was very hurt by the treatment he got because of the Beach stuff but money wise Im sure he hated to lose when he could have settled at the begging for a lot less. There has been no lifestyle changes for Rockey because of money. As far as KD he will be your next president of hockey ops in 3 more years. |
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Post by BigT on Apr 14, 2023 5:46:50 GMT -6
I’m not gonna get right into it. I just won’t. But I’ve said over the past year or so, that the org wanted everyone from the Beach fiasco out. All of them. Rockwell basically said that when he laid into Phillip Thompson when he asked a question at the Hawks conference they had. I believe this was the plan all along. They only hired KD to rid themselves of everyone from that era. It apparently cost Rocky over 60 million. He’s not happy. And that was just Beach. The other kid from Michigan got something near 10. So Rockwell wasn’t happy. That’s all I’ll say about that. KD was hired to do the impossible. He’s done that. I do not believe he’ll be here past the emergence of this team. His successor is already planning his death underneath him!!! Rocky makes about 50 mil a year Wirtz corp is worth close to 6 bill. This is a tax write off did not hurt them at all. I believe he was very hurt by the treatment he got because of the Beach stuff but money wise Im sure he hated to lose when he could have settled at the begging for a lot less. There has been no lifestyle changes for Rockey because of money. As far as KD he will be your next president of hockey ops in 3 more years. Couple of things. You can’t take out “worth” out of a company. Maybe a loan? For every company, cash is king. Gotta have cash on hand to be fluid in this world. The Hawks were the ones with all the penalties and lawyers etc. I’d say with all the lawsuits, lawyers, that report that was one, NHL fines. I’d say the Hawks were out close to 100 million. Rocky would never spend his money on this. It’s the teams money that gets spent, he’s rich and entitled. He’s pissed. The Hawks probably don’t have that much cash on hand. It’s crippling to a team. I’m sure Rocky failed to make any money off of the Hawks the last year and a bit. So it did affect his bottom line. I’m in no way sticking up for him. Just stating the obvious. People don’t stay rich by giving money away. And I’m sure a Wirtz is used to winning all the time. So this pissed him off. Ohhh the life of the entitled!!! |
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Post by steamer on Apr 14, 2023 7:27:30 GMT -6
If KD does not have much success in the next couple of years and is replaced his legacy will be the one that got rid of Toews and Kane. Might not be fair but that will the consensus I believe. that's exactly what he is getting paid to do, so... I admire and appreciate Kane and Toews as much as anyone here but it’s the end. They are the last vestige of the closest thing to a dynasty that Chicago sports has ever seen (edit - Bulls were the greatest Chicago dynasty) But it’s over and it’s actually been over for a couple of years and someone did need to be “the bad guy” eventually. Those 2 players and a helluva supporting cast brought us unbelievable hockey success so it’s hard for me and everyone else to let it go. Did there have to be a total tear down? Maybe not but that’s what was decided and here we are. LR again said in his postgame comments that this is the plan. He was told in no uncertain terms that this is a tear down and rebuild and he bought into it and as he said last night his job is on the ice and to motivate players regardless of who they are, where they were drafted, etc. So while I was sad watching last night, I was also trying to be realistic about it. |
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Post by steamer on Apr 15, 2023 14:30:29 GMT -6
KD’s worst move so far was to not keep Colliton through this season and hire Luke now.
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Post by OldTimeHawky on May 11, 2023 18:26:22 GMT -6
Before the draft lotto Kyle wrote his 4mnth old daughters name on the palm of his hand, and his daughter who died in 2021.
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Post by OldTimeHawky on May 11, 2023 18:31:58 GMT -6
KD’s worst move so far was to not keep Colliton through this season and hire Luke now. Why? They got Bedard and Luke has a season under his belt. Plus Luke got to work with the young kids last training camp before sending then back to juniors and college. I say it's his best move, so far. And Luke wanted to be a HC, so he would've went somewhere else. |
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Post by vadarx on May 11, 2023 19:39:50 GMT -6
KD’s worst move so far was to not keep Colliton through this season and hire Luke now. Why? They got Bedard and Luke has a season under his belt. Plus Luke got to work with the young kids last training camp before sending then back to juniors and college. I say it's his best move, so far. And Luke wanted to be a HC, so he would've went somewhere else. yeah, I agree. it was easy to think that maybe we brought in too good of a coach for tanking purposes during the regular season but all's well that ends well. he could be The Man for a long time in Chicago and I hope that he is. |
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Post by bigbarn27 on May 11, 2023 20:48:05 GMT -6
Ok for shits and grins wanted to ask, as most know Im not the biggest KD fan, how much credit does he get for winning the lottery. Things worked out nicely and luck had a lot to do with it but I have to credit KD just needed to say that out loud.
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Post by BigT on May 11, 2023 21:35:23 GMT -6
Ok for shits and grins wanted to ask, as most know Im not the biggest KD fan, how much credit does he get for winning the lottery. Things worked out nicely and luck had a lot to do with it but I have to credit KD just needed to say that out loud. He gets some. It was his idea to even go down this path. Ive said before that if players purposely lose and coaches do too. It’s bad karma. I think both CBJs and the Ducks both laid down for some games. Especially at the end. Whereas the Hawks seemed to pick it up. So he’s gotta get some credit!!! |
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Post by steamer on May 12, 2023 7:21:26 GMT -6
KD’s worst move so far was to not keep Colliton through this season and hire Luke now. Why? They got Bedard and Luke has a season under his belt. Plus Luke got to work with the young kids last training camp before sending then back to juniors and college. I say it's his best move, so far. And Luke wanted to be a HC, so he would've went somewhere else. You’re absolutely right. I had said that more in jest as it looked like we might draft 4th or 5th. I am high on LR; excited about the #1 pick and believe KD did a good job with last year’s draft. My #1 concern is with player development and if that goes well then everything is looking very good for a few years out. |
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Post by hsbob on May 12, 2023 8:39:22 GMT -6
Ok for shits and grins wanted to ask, as most know Im not the biggest KD fan, how much credit does he get for winning the lottery. Things worked out nicely and luck had a lot to do with it but I have to credit KD just needed to say that out loud. Me neither but criticism aside,no GM did more to deplete their roster last summer in preparation for a tank season. The team either traded or just lost their 1st,3rd,4th,5th and (21yro)7th leading goal scorers,five of their eight top scorers and MAF with the return of picks only. It woulda been good to see one of the vet D-men go at the same time but it wasn't to be. If McCabe brought a 1st at this year's TDL,how is there no interest at last year's TDL or last summer? Maybe the right offers didn't exist for McCabe then or for the guys who walked but I believe MAF for a 2nd and Carpenter for a 5th were last year's only TDL moves. The team would have been weaker defensively w/o McCabe and it would have given the team a lot more TOI to assess and develop one of the many 20 something D-men. Luck ain't a bad thing to have,let's hope he stays lucky! |
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Post by OldTimeHawky on May 14, 2023 7:42:26 GMT -6
Kyle takes flack from some people, I was one of them at first, but I'm liking this guy now.
Born in Ottawa, got a bachelors degree in Sports Administration and got a job with the Sens before replacing a certain video coach in Chicago after the 2010 Cup, worked his way up to assistant GM in 2018.
He learned how not to do things by the last guy and he's listening to his staff and making tough decisions. Plus he's articulate and personable, Stan was monotone and dull.
So I don't care about his age or if he played in the NHL, he loves hockey and he's a no bs straight forward guy who loves the Hawks, sounds good to me. Plus he seems to be good luck, maybe he's a leprechaun.
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Post by OldTimeHawky on May 14, 2023 7:50:13 GMT -6
Ok for shits and grins wanted to ask, as most know Im not the biggest KD fan, how much credit does he get for winning the lottery. Things worked out nicely and luck had a lot to do with it but I have to credit KD just needed to say that out loud. Me neither but criticism aside,no GM did more to deplete their roster last summer in preparation for a tank season. The team either traded or just lost their 1st,3rd,4th,5th and (21yro)7th leading goal scorers,five of their eight top scorers and MAF with the return of picks only. It woulda been good to see one of the vet D-men go at the same time but it wasn't to be. If McCabe brought a 1st at this year's TDL,how is there no interest at last year's TDL or last summer? Maybe the right offers didn't exist for McCabe then or for the guys who walked but I believe MAF for a 2nd and Carpenter for a 5th were last year's only TDL moves. The team would have been weaker defensively w/o McCabe and it would have given the team a lot more TOI to assess and develop one of the many 20 something D-men. Luck ain't a bad thing to have,let's hope he stays lucky! The thing I like about how it played out, the Hawks got a new GM and he came out and said he's doing a full rebuild, it's different if he was the GM for a while and just gutted the team to get Bedard. I'm not going to go over the what ifs about the past, the future is here and things are looking good. |
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Post by hsbob on May 15, 2023 11:05:10 GMT -6
Me neither but criticism aside,no GM did more to deplete their roster last summer in preparation for a tank season. The team either traded or just lost their 1st,3rd,4th,5th and (21yro)7th leading goal scorers,five of their eight top scorers and MAF with the return of picks only. It woulda been good to see one of the vet D-men go at the same time but it wasn't to be. If McCabe brought a 1st at this year's TDL,how is there no interest at last year's TDL or last summer? Maybe the right offers didn't exist for McCabe then or for the guys who walked but I believe MAF for a 2nd and Carpenter for a 5th were last year's only TDL moves. The team would have been weaker defensively w/o McCabe and it would have given the team a lot more TOI to assess and develop one of the many 20 something D-men. Luck ain't a bad thing to have,let's hope he stays lucky! The thing I like about how it played out, the Hawks got a new GM and he came out and said he's doing a full rebuild, it's different if he was the GM for a while and just gutted the team to get Bedard. I'm not going to go over the what ifs about the past, the future is here and things are looking good. In the post above this one you do give him credit for being here a while,albeit not as the GM. He get's credit for the experience of working his way to AGM in '18' but somehow no responsibility for the damage to the Org that was done in that time-span? The team was gutted just to get Bedard none the less,very talented players between 21 -24 were moved for picks along with vets MAF,Kane and McCabe resulting in FIVE 1st round picks alone and other good picks from Domi,Lafferty...ect...ect,as well,to go along with the team's own picks form 27th and 30th place finishes.
You and many others are optimistic and rightly so with the good fortune of Bedard,the mountain of picks and cap-space from all the gutting and tanking should be a huge advantage and come with expectations attached.
You tell us in another thread to talk about the future,not the past.....why? I have a lot more of one than the other and I'll probably talk about it. Why can't we assess the "what-if",roster decisions made last season?
The future is here? Just when I was ready to accept another veteran-laden team with a few kids botton-feeding it's way to more high picks. I think we'd both agree the future is Bedard and a young team competing at a high level but that looks to be in the future and some say well in the future.
His performance so far gives you and many others confidence,he's the 'toast of the town' since winning the sweepstakes. His inexperience at building a team from the ground-up and the amount of hockey insight available from his superiors give me pause. I do expect improvement however,the massive amount of high picks and cap-space to go along with Bedard should assure it.....how much improvement depends on so many things.
You like the guy and I don't........that doesn't matter one bit. |
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Post by mvr on May 15, 2023 12:07:11 GMT -6
I value loyalty above all.
For this reason, I will always have trouble with an insecure young boss (fast-track promoted) who feels the need to clean house so he won't be questioned. In so doing, he disrespects those who came before him. It happens too often, and not just in sport.
After three cups and countless good experiences, Toews and Kane (like the others) deserved to go on their terms. I do not believe it was necessary nor was it wise to push them out. But of course I also objected to how Hjalmarsson and Crawford among others (and Coach Quenneville) left as well......
Stan Mikita won one cup here. Tony O took the team to the finals twice. Neither were pushed out before they were ready to go.
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Post by ebonyraptor on May 15, 2023 13:11:14 GMT -6
I value loyalty above all.For this reason, I will always have trouble with an insecure young boss (fast-track promoted) who feels the need to clean house so he won't be questioned. In so doing, he disrespects those who came before him. It happens too often, and not just in sport. After three cups and countless good experiences, Toews and Kane (like the others) deserved to go on their terms. I do not believe it was necessary nor was it wise to push them out. But of course I also objected to how Hjalmarsson and Crawford among others (and Coach Quenneville) left as well...... Stan Mikita won one cup here. Tony O took the team to the finals twice. Neither were pushed out before they were ready to go. Where is that loyalty placed? Is it to the players or is it to the fans who pay those player's salaries? A case can be made for either side. The opinion that KD cleaned house due to being insecure could be true - OR - it could be for the reason he stated which was he thinks the best plan to build a Cup contending team is to wipe the slate clean and start building from the ground up. We're all dealing from conjecture and bias. And the world goes round. |
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Post by mvr on May 15, 2023 13:16:59 GMT -6
Lots of fans value Toews and Kane and did not want them to go.
Davidson's "plan" might work, but it also might not. In the meantime, he has sent two star players packing who didn't fit with his agenda.
Davidson has won nothing so far. Kane and Toews both won three cups.
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Post by irmaks on May 15, 2023 13:21:02 GMT -6
I value loyalty above all. For this reason, I will always have trouble with an insecure young boss (fast-track promoted) who feels the need to clean house so he won't be questioned. In so doing, he disrespects those who came before him. It happens too often, and not just in sport. After three cups and countless good experiences, Toews and Kane (like the others) deserved to go on their terms. I do not believe it was necessary nor was it wise to push them out. But of course I also objected to how Hjalmarsson and Crawford among others (and Coach Quenneville) left as well...... Stan Mikita won one cup here. Tony O took the team to the finals twice. Neither were pushed out before they were ready to go. Are you saying Kane left not on his terms? |
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Post by mvr on May 15, 2023 13:42:45 GMT -6
I am.
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Post by 2old4this on May 15, 2023 14:55:35 GMT -6
I value loyalty above all. For this reason, I will always have trouble with an insecure young boss (fast-track promoted) who feels the need to clean house so he won't be questioned. In so doing, he disrespects those who came before him. It happens too often, and not just in sport. After three cups and countless good experiences, Toews and Kane (like the others) deserved to go on their terms. I do not believe it was necessary nor was it wise to push them out. But of course I also objected to how Hjalmarsson and Crawford among others (and Coach Quenneville) left as well...... Stan Mikita won one cup here. Tony O took the team to the finals twice. Neither were pushed out before they were ready to go. Are you saying Kane left not on his terms? My underst anding is that Coach Q was dumped in the wake of the sex assault scandal. I could be mistaken of course. Wouldn't be the first time. |
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Post by vadarx on May 15, 2023 15:36:02 GMT -6
Are you saying Kane left not on his terms? My underst anding is that Coach Q was dumped in the wake of the sex assault scandal. I could be mistaken of course. Wouldn't be the first time. Q got shit canned by Bowman because he finally lost enough games that SB could force him out and replace him with a lap dog. |
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Post by Nikos on May 15, 2023 16:04:13 GMT -6
Kyle Davidson open to trading up in 2023 NHL draft
In a recent radio interview KD is quoted "We've got eight picks in the first three rounds of the draft, which is a lot," Davidson said. "And I will concede that that's a lot. I think it's probably unlikely that we make all those picks. "So how that manifests itself, whether it's in a move up, whether we move some picks for future picks or something like that. You know, that remains to be seen. But that's a lot of picks."
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Post by ebonyraptor on May 15, 2023 16:57:21 GMT -6
Lots of fans value Toews and Kane and did not want them to go. Davidson's "plan" might work, but it also might not. In the meantime, he has sent two star players packing who didn't fit with his agenda. Davidson has won nothing so far. Kane and Toews both won three cups. His agenda is to win the Cup, which is something I agree with and I'm pretty sure many, if not most, of my fellow Hawks fans agree. Continuing on the path of trying to win the Cup with Toews and Kane is what the previous regime did year after year and it got less and less likely it could be accomplished as the years rolled by. For as much as T&K meant to the Hawks and the glorious decade of the T&K era - it came to an inevitable end. Would Hawks ownership and management show the fans loyalty by continuing to forgo legitimately trying to win the the Cup for a few more years to be able to be nice to T&K? Why not just change the team name to the Chicago Toews and Kanes? Nostalgia and all happy feeling aside - KD (with the blessings of Danny/Rocky) had the balls to do what needed to be done (several years ago). I'll applaud Toews and Kane when their jerseys are raised to the rafters. but right now I applaud KD. |
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Post by mvr on May 16, 2023 5:35:38 GMT -6
Lots of fans value Toews and Kane and did not want them to go. Davidson's "plan" might work, but it also might not. In the meantime, he has sent two star players packing who didn't fit with his agenda. Davidson has won nothing so far. Kane and Toews both won three cups. His agenda is to win the Cup, which is something I agree with and I'm pretty sure many, if not most, of my fellow Hawks fans agree. Continuing on the path of trying to win the Cup with Toews and Kane is what the previous regime did year after year and it got less and less likely it could be accomplished as the years rolled by. For as much as T&K meant to the Hawks and the glorious decade of the T&K era - it came to an inevitable end. Would Hawks ownership and management show the fans loyalty by continuing to forgo legitimately trying to win the the Cup for a few more years to be able to be nice to T&K? Why not just change the team name to the Chicago Toews and Kanes? Nostalgia and all happy feeling aside - KD (with the blessings of Danny/Rocky) had the balls to do what needed to be done (several years ago). I'll applaud Toews and Kane when their jerseys are raised to the rafters. but right now I applaud KD. You seem to be buying into Davidson's narrative that the team cannot grow with quality veterans here. I don't believe this to be true. Dumping them is not what "needed to be done." Many young teams benefit by learning from proven champions. Toews and Kane are winners as was Crawford, Hjalmarsson and all the others dumped by the previous administration. The problem in Chicago was not team leadership. It was poor roster support, insufficient depth (and especially physicality), constant personnel turnover, and (until recently) dreadful coaching. The old veterans are gone. But new ones will be brought in as plugs to fill holes. The only difference is that Davidson has purged the roster of anyone with the pedigree to challenge his "wisdom." |
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Post by BigT on May 16, 2023 6:40:05 GMT -6
My main concern with your train of thoughts here MVR is that you seem to be saying that only Toews and Kane could provide that leadership. And no one else.
Obviously the management doesn’t seem to think they’d be a good fit. I don’t believe he’s lying when he says younger guys are timid around them. Afraid to speak up. Guys like T Johnson has as much pedigree as anyone.
I fully understand many wanted the storey book ending. It’s not the way it went. If it doesn’t work out, then you have every right to say you’re right!!!
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