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Post by galaxytrash on Aug 20, 2024 18:06:40 GMT -6
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Post by squishy24 on Aug 20, 2024 19:38:54 GMT -6
Thats probably why the Oils got him. Already have a loaded team ready to win the cup, just need someone who can fill in the holes, just like those 2013 and 2015 teams. If the Oil (or other teams) are rebulding, SB definitely not the guy The main difference I see is that Stan inherited the 2010 team and didn't make any moves that put that team over the top. He'll need to do that for the Oil--make a move that puts them over the top. I agree that Edmonton is likely thinking that Stan is the one to fill holes, but I don't think he's the ones to do it. Plus, I'd put money on the 2010, 2013 and 2015 'hawks beating the 2024 Oil in a series. I don't think Edmonton was as-deep as 2015, much less 2010 or 2013. No argument here. I do wonder if SB is still high on “his guys”, maybe he could replace Ceci with Murphy
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Post by squishy24 on Aug 20, 2024 19:45:21 GMT -6
Apparently Stlouis isnt the only team that used the offer sheet, at least, for Broberg. Rumors are there were two other teams and its a reason why the salary offer got so high. So maybe we would see more offer sheet in the future More on Armie - “ St. Louis Blues general manager Doug Armstrong spoke today about offer sheets and said he isn’t aware of any GM code regarding the little-used tactic. Armstrong used two offer sheets last week to pry Dylan Holloway and Philip Broberg away from the Edmonton Oilers and poured water on the notion that he wouldn’t have done so if former Oilers general manager Ken Holland was still on the job. Armstrong added that he would have tendered the offer sheets to Edmonton even if his own mother was in charge of the team.”
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Post by galaxytrash on Aug 20, 2024 19:57:51 GMT -6
idk if broberg and holloway are happy to go to the blues but they're certainly going to be richer for it.
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Post by BigT on Aug 20, 2024 20:08:24 GMT -6
idk if broberg and holloway are happy to go to the blues but they're certainly going to be richer for it. Can’t blame them. That’s a massive increase over what they were asking for. The only problem moving forward is to keep em, they’ll have to tender them a 10% raise just to qualify them. So they’ll never get them cheaper if they fail!!!
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Post by tincup on Aug 20, 2024 23:05:13 GMT -6
idk if broberg and holloway are happy to go to the blues but they're certainly going to be richer for it. If they had signed them to those numbers, either or both could have been part of a package that the Oilers might have parlayed into what they really could use, a potential #1 goaltender in Askarov. Now they have to settle for a couple of draft picks worth a lot less.
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Post by galaxytrash on Aug 20, 2024 23:24:44 GMT -6
idk if broberg and holloway are happy to go to the blues but they're certainly going to be richer for it. If they had signed them to those numbers, either or both could have been part of a package that the Oilers might have parlayed into what they really could use, a potential #1 goaltender in Askarov. Now they have to settle for a couple of draft picks worth a lot less. good point. did the oiler's management drag their feet on contract talks? or maybe they were just crossing their fingers nobody would think to offer sheet them?
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Post by mikeveisor on Aug 21, 2024 7:42:19 GMT -6
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Post by hsbob on Aug 21, 2024 7:57:49 GMT -6
The Blues also sent unsigned 2023 fifth-round pick Paul Fischer and a 2028 third-round pick to the Oilers in exchange for future considerations. Apparently to convince SB not to match the offer sheets. If this is true, then there is really nothing “shrewd” to what Armstrong did The Edmonton Oilers will have a new GM by 2028........mark my words!
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Post by BigT on Aug 21, 2024 7:59:36 GMT -6
A few things JayZ said the other day. Askarov wants to be a starter……. Next year. Not sure how the Hawks facilitate that. The Hawks would have to send a tendy back. More than likely Commesso. A package for an unproven NHL goalie would probably be a 1st rounder (more than likely Toronta). A top prospect (at least EDM or similar). And probably Commesso.
I think that’s too much at this point. I would not do that. My best would be a 2nd rounder and maybe a prospect like Dach. But if they want more, go ahead. If he was the best goalie prospect, they don’t sign Sarros, and they don’t get a vet backup. I don’t think his value is what Trotz wants. Plus the Hawks are within the division. So I just don’t see it happening!!!
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Post by vadarx on Aug 21, 2024 8:22:09 GMT -6
A few things JayZ said the other day. Askarov wants to be a starter……. Next year. Not sure how the Hawks facilitate that. The Hawks would have to send a tendy back. More than likely Commesso. A package for an unproven NHL goalie would probably be a 1st rounder (more than likely Toronta). A top prospect (at least EDM or similar). And probably Commesso. I think that’s too much at this point. I would not do that. My best would be a 2nd rounder and maybe a prospect like Dach. But if they want more, go ahead. If he was the best goalie prospect, they don’t sign Sarros, and they don’t get a vet backup. I don’t think his value is what Trotz wants. Plus the Hawks are within the division. So I just don’t see it happening!!! I'd make that trade (loafs 1st, Commesso, and EDM). Askarov is potentially the goalie of the future that we need. with all of the extra picks we have, I would have no issue giving a later 1st and and d prospect to upgrade the goaltending. also, last year was likely abnormal for Mrazek. he isn't likely to remain that healthy the next two years. Brossoit is a career back up. either one could be traded at the deadline and Askarov can be given a shot at the top spot in 25-26.
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Post by hsbob on Aug 21, 2024 8:25:08 GMT -6
idk if broberg and holloway are happy to go to the blues but they're certainly going to be richer for it. If they had signed them to those numbers, either or both could have been part of a package that the Oilers might have parlayed into what they really could use, a potential #1 goaltender in Askarov. Now they have to settle for a couple of draft picks worth a lot less. If both of those promising,young players could have been signed for the amounts reported and weren't........how is that NOT a GM failure? Don't young players who've come-up with the team,who've already shown NHL abilities and will continue to develop offer a 'win now' team a lot more than non-1st round draft picks? If the two were willing to take those amounts on short-term deals,it might not have taken much more to ink both for five years,we've seen a LOT of GM's sign their young players to longer deals lately BUT I guess they weren't DUMBASS' guys.
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Post by vadarx on Aug 21, 2024 8:43:39 GMT -6
If they had signed them to those numbers, either or both could have been part of a package that the Oilers might have parlayed into what they really could use, a potential #1 goaltender in Askarov. Now they have to settle for a couple of draft picks worth a lot less. If both of those promising,young players could have been signed for the amounts reported and weren't........how is that NOT a GM failure? Don't young players who've come-up with the team,who've already shown NHL abilities and will continue to develop offer a 'win now' team a lot more than non-1st round draft picks? If the two were willing to take those amounts on short-term deals,it might not have taken much more to ink both for five years,we've seen a LOT of GM's sign their young players to longer deals lately BUT I guess they weren't DUMBASS' guys. i have to believe his late hiring really hurt his ability to negotiate with these two players. I also have to believe that Jackson told him to play hardball with both of them. in the end, there was no way they commit that much money to Broberg, in particular, nor could they commit term to him either, as he hasn't been great for them as yet. still surprised they didn't match for Halloway, though.
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Post by Nikos on Aug 21, 2024 9:43:24 GMT -6
A few things JayZ said the other day. Askarov wants to be a starter……. Next year. Not sure how the Hawks facilitate that. The Hawks would have to send a tendy back. More than likely Commesso. A package for an unproven NHL goalie would probably be a 1st rounder (more than likely Toronta). A top prospect (at least EDM or similar). And probably Commesso. I think that’s too much at this point. I would not do that. My best would be a 2nd rounder and maybe a prospect like Dach. But if they want more, go ahead. If he was the best goalie prospect, they don’t sign Sarros, and they don’t get a vet backup. I don’t think his value is what Trotz wants. Plus the Hawks are within the division. So I just don’t see it happening!!! I'd make that trade (loafs 1st, Commesso, and EDM). Askarov is potentially the goalie of the future that we need. with all of the extra picks we have, I would have no issue giving a later 1st and and d prospect to upgrade the goaltending. also, last year was likely abnormal for Mrazek. he isn't likely to remain that healthy the next two years. Brossoit is a career back up. either one could be traded at the deadline and Askarov can be given a shot at the top spot on 25-26. I believe Askarov wants to be in NHL this season, minimum as a back-up. Not sure where he fit if Hawks traded for him based on how the current roster is constructed (Mrazek and Brossoit) signed.
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Post by hsbob on Aug 21, 2024 9:47:10 GMT -6
If both of those promising,young players could have been signed for the amounts reported and weren't........how is that NOT a GM failure? Don't young players who've come-up with the team,who've already shown NHL abilities and will continue to develop offer a 'win now' team a lot more than non-1st round draft picks? If the two were willing to take those amounts on short-term deals,it might not have taken much more to ink both for five years,we've seen a LOT of GM's sign their young players to longer deals lately BUT I guess they weren't DUMBASS' guys. i have to believe his late hiring really hurt his ability to negotiate with these two players. I also have to believe that Jackson told him to play hardball with both of them. in the end, there was no way they commit that much money to Broberg, in particular, nor could they commit term to him either, as he hasn't been great for them as yet. still surprised they didn't match for Halloway, though. That above article made it sound like both were willing to sign very reasonable deals and DUMBASS did get there almost a month ago. The large-framed 22yro center and even larger framed 23yro D-man haven't shown a lot yet but neither's gotten a lot of opportunity on a fairly loaded team.....81gms for Broberg in 3 years and a paltry 11:22 of average TOI for Holloway. The #8 OA D-man was a solid +8 in his 10 PO games and the #14 OA center won over 57% of his draws last year.......both should improve with bigger roles.
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Post by hsbob on Aug 21, 2024 9:52:26 GMT -6
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Post by tincup on Aug 21, 2024 10:43:21 GMT -6
i have to believe his late hiring really hurt his ability to negotiate with these two players. I also have to believe that Jackson told him to play hardball with both of them. in the end, there was no way they commit that much money to Broberg, in particular, nor could they commit term to him either, as he hasn't been great for them as yet. still surprised they didn't match for Halloway, though. That above article made it sound like both were willing to sign very reasonable deals and DUMBASS did get there almost a month ago. The large-framed 22yro center and even larger framed 23yro D-man haven't shown a lot yet but neither's gotten a lot of opportunity on a fairly loaded team.....81gms for Broberg in 3 years and a paltry 11:22 of average TOI for Holloway. The #8 OA D-man was a solid +8 in his 10 PO games and the #14 OA center won over 57% of his draws last year.......both should improve with bigger roles. Both players showed their potential in that seven game final series. Seems a fairly large miscue not to have negotiated better. I was put into a state of somnambulism yesterday, except I was driving, not walking, listening to Bowman's droning voice on local radio explaining for twenty minutes how the events played out. Don't miss him at all.
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Post by Nikos on Aug 21, 2024 11:04:46 GMT -6
Niklas Hjalmarsson probably made a similar list in the past.
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Post by Nikos on Aug 21, 2024 11:10:30 GMT -6
That above article made it sound like both were willing to sign very reasonable deals and DUMBASS did get there almost a month ago. The large-framed 22yro center and even larger framed 23yro D-man haven't shown a lot yet but neither's gotten a lot of opportunity on a fairly loaded team.....81gms for Broberg in 3 years and a paltry 11:22 of average TOI for Holloway. The #8 OA D-man was a solid +8 in his 10 PO games and the #14 OA center won over 57% of his draws last year.......both should improve with bigger roles. Both players showed their potential in that seven game final series. Seems a fairly large miscue not to have negotiated better. I was put into a state of somnambulism yesterday, except I was driving, not walking, listening to Bowman's droning voice on local radio explaining for twenty minutes how the events played out. Don't miss him at all. Both players played much better in the SCF. Not negotiating in good faith early in the process hurt the Oilers, they would have been able to sign both at much reasonable deals. I understand it is a business and you have control, and you can wait them out, for me personally I hope we see more offer sheets. It will make the summer months much more interesting.
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Post by Nikos on Aug 21, 2024 11:34:41 GMT -6
Flyers put F Johansen on unconditional waivers, citing material breach. His agent will fight and protects his rights and work with the NHLPA. Flyers will save $4M cap hit and in addition this move also saves the Preds a $4M cap hit this year.
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Post by nighbor on Aug 21, 2024 11:47:54 GMT -6
i have to believe his late hiring really hurt his ability to negotiate with these two players. I also have to believe that Jackson told him to play hardball with both of them. in the end, there was no way they commit that much money to Broberg, in particular, nor could they commit term to him either, as he hasn't been great for them as yet. still surprised they didn't match for Halloway, though. That above article made it sound like both were willing to sign very reasonable deals and DUMBASS did get there almost a month ago. The large-framed 22yro center and even larger framed 23yro D-man haven't shown a lot yet but neither's gotten a lot of opportunity on a fairly loaded team.....81gms for Broberg in 3 years and a paltry 11:22 of average TOI for Holloway. The #8 OA D-man was a solid +8 in his 10 PO games and the #14 OA center won over 57% of his draws last year.......both should improve with bigger roles. The previous GM had all last season and until July 1st to sign them. His failure to do so pissed off both players and they eagerly signed the offer sheets. The chances are the offer sheets were signed before Stan was hired.
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Post by BigT on Aug 21, 2024 11:59:09 GMT -6
That above article made it sound like both were willing to sign very reasonable deals and DUMBASS did get there almost a month ago. The large-framed 22yro center and even larger framed 23yro D-man haven't shown a lot yet but neither's gotten a lot of opportunity on a fairly loaded team.....81gms for Broberg in 3 years and a paltry 11:22 of average TOI for Holloway. The #8 OA D-man was a solid +8 in his 10 PO games and the #14 OA center won over 57% of his draws last year.......both should improve with bigger roles. The previous GM had all last season and until July 1st to sign them. His failure to do so pissed off both players and they eagerly signed the offer sheets. The chances are the offer sheets were signed before Stan was hired. This is just not true. The team elected not to sign those two players because their worth was not set. The players did not want an extension last year as it would more than likely be off of their past performance. The 2 players were qualified and the oilers wanted them to accept them. Scambo came in a month or so ago. He had every chance to sign them to what Elliot Friedman described. He and the oilers elected not to. My best guess is that Scambo didn’t really care for them. He probably wants a Cup at all costs (obviously) and had no time for young kids. But my guess is both become decent NHL players and all they got was a 2nd and a 3rd rounder. Kinda poor management in my eyes!!!
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Post by LordKOTL on Aug 21, 2024 12:31:12 GMT -6
The main difference I see is that Stan inherited the 2010 team and didn't make any moves that put that team over the top. He'll need to do that for the Oil--make a move that puts them over the top. I agree that Edmonton is likely thinking that Stan is the one to fill holes, but I don't think he's the ones to do it. Plus, I'd put money on the 2010, 2013 and 2015 'hawks beating the 2024 Oil in a series. I don't think Edmonton was as-deep as 2015, much less 2010 or 2013. No argument here. I do wonder if SB is still high on “his guys”, maybe he could replace Ceci with Murphy Interesting idea. Of course I'm hoping for a unicorn deal where Stan takes Jones off our hands but I cannot see that happening in any way where we come out the winners given what EDM has to offer. If both of those promising,young players could have been signed for the amounts reported and weren't........how is that NOT a GM failure? Don't young players who've come-up with the team,who've already shown NHL abilities and will continue to develop offer a 'win now' team a lot more than non-1st round draft picks? If the two were willing to take those amounts on short-term deals,it might not have taken much more to ink both for five years,we've seen a LOT of GM's sign their young players to longer deals lately BUT I guess they weren't DUMBASS' guys. i have to believe his late hiring really hurt his ability to negotiate with these two players. I also have to believe that Jackson told him to play hardball with both of them. in the end, there was no way they commit that much money to Broberg, in particular, nor could they commit term to him either, as he hasn't been great for them as yet. still surprised they didn't match for Halloway, though. If that was the case then it would go against Bowman's previous modus operandii--which is improbable, but not impossible. Unless Bowman changed and the reason for his resignation doesn't fit that, he still should want to be the smartest guy in the room. Either way, even though I'm not a Bowman fan by any stretch of the imagination, the timing of his hiring and his ability to make the signings when he did may not be fully his fault. But on the other hand, maybe neither of them fit into what his vision is for a cup-winning team. I don't know. I do agree with hsbob in that I think his tenure might be short-lived. I don't think he inherited the same depth-of-team that he did in 2010 and I'm not quite sure he can pull that team up enough to replicate the 'hawks success unless he completely reverses his previous form and doesn't think he's the smartest guy in the room. He's got Draisaitl, McDavid, Eckholm, and couple others who will need to be re-signed soon. I'm not too sure about their depth chart but I'm really not seeing the players available which stepped in as our teams in 2010 and 2013 lost personnel. No Saad, Leddy, Crawford, etc. My $0,02: I could be wrong.
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Post by BigT on Aug 21, 2024 13:29:10 GMT -6
I will say this. If Scambo can get this team over the hump, and keep em there momentarily, like maybe even 2-3 years. I’ll give him all the credit. Sure he has a great team. They may even win this upcoming year. And I don’t think they need to win 2-3 Cups. Just win one and be super competitive for the 2-3 years afterwards. If they go into cap hell, and have to dismantle, it’ll be a disaster. Especially if they don’t win.
What Scambo does is what the government does. Kick the can down the road, and let the next generation worry about it. I know Scambo will probably be working for the Canadian government soon. He fits the bill perfectly!!!
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Post by tincup on Aug 21, 2024 14:00:12 GMT -6
I will say this. If Scambo can get this team over the hump, and keep em there momentarily, like maybe even 2-3 years. I’ll give him all the credit. Sure he has a great team. They may even win this upcoming year. And I don’t think they need to win 2-3 Cups. Just win one and be super competitive for the 2-3 years afterwards. If they go into cap hell, and have to dismantle, it’ll be a disaster. Especially if they don’t win. What Scambo does is what the government does. Kick the can down the road, and let the next generation worry about it. I know Scambo will probably be working for the Canadian government soon. He fits the bill perfectly!!! Senator Stan Bowman. Good gawd. Please no.
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Post by nighbor on Aug 21, 2024 14:13:50 GMT -6
The previous GM had all last season and until July 1st to sign them. His failure to do so pissed off both players and they eagerly signed the offer sheets. The chances are the offer sheets were signed before Stan was hired. This is just not true. The team elected not to sign those two players because their worth was not set. The players did not want an extension last year as it would more than likely be off of their past performance. The 2 players were qualified and the oilers wanted them to accept them. Scambo came in a month or so ago. He had every chance to sign them to what Elliot Friedman described. He and the oilers elected not to. My best guess is that Scambo didn’t really care for them. He probably wants a Cup at all costs (obviously) and had no time for young kids. But my guess is both become decent NHL players and all they got was a 2nd and a 3rd rounder. Kinda poor management in my eyes!!! Stan was reinstated on July 10th and free agency started on July 1st and I am positive GM Armstrong didn't wait around to see who hired Stan and say lets screw Stan. Every organization starts with a iow offer to insure not to over pay. I believe that if the previous management would have offered them 2 years @ 3M/year they would have signed. The worth of a player is what you can afford to pay. It didn't stop Armstrong from setting their worth.. To simple old me you want Stan to do for the Oilers what you hated him doing in Chicago.
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Post by vadarx on Aug 21, 2024 15:59:03 GMT -6
I'd make that trade (loafs 1st, Commesso, and EDM). Askarov is potentially the goalie of the future that we need. with all of the extra picks we have, I would have no issue giving a later 1st and and d prospect to upgrade the goaltending. also, last year was likely abnormal for Mrazek. he isn't likely to remain that healthy the next two years. Brossoit is a career back up. either one could be traded at the deadline and Askarov can be given a shot at the top spot on 25-26. I believe Askarov wants to be in NHL this season, minimum as a back-up. Not sure where he fit if Hawks traded for him based on how the current roster is constructed (Mrazek and Brossoit) signed. I feel pretty sure him coming here alone would be good enough for him to deal with leading the way in the Rock this season. dude will have a clear path to potentially being The Guy right at the beginning of the something around here and we have lots cap space.
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Post by vadarx on Aug 21, 2024 16:04:03 GMT -6
i have to believe his late hiring really hurt his ability to negotiate with these two players. I also have to believe that Jackson told him to play hardball with both of them. in the end, there was no way they commit that much money to Broberg, in particular, nor could they commit term to him either, as he hasn't been great for them as yet. still surprised they didn't match for Halloway, though. That above article made it sound like both were willing to sign very reasonable deals and DUMBASS did get there almost a month ago. The large-framed 22yro center and even larger framed 23yro D-man haven't shown a lot yet but neither's gotten a lot of opportunity on a fairly loaded team.....81gms for Broberg in 3 years and a paltry 11:22 of average TOI for Holloway. The #8 OA D-man was a solid +8 in his 10 PO games and the #14 OA center won over 57% of his draws last year.......both should improve with bigger roles. more than anything, the blows just offered him too much, they couldn't match that. they could've offered them sooner, but I guess they need to save every single penny for the next two summers? Draisaitl and Bouchard are going to cost here very soon and after next July 1, 97 is going to COST.
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Post by LordKOTL on Aug 21, 2024 16:26:05 GMT -6
I will say this. If Scambo can get this team over the hump, and keep em there momentarily, like maybe even 2-3 years. I’ll give him all the credit. Sure he has a great team. They may even win this upcoming year. And I don’t think they need to win 2-3 Cups. Just win one and be super competitive for the 2-3 years afterwards. If they go into cap hell, and have to dismantle, it’ll be a disaster. Especially if they don’t win. What Scambo does is what the government does. Kick the can down the road, and let the next generation worry about it. I know Scambo will probably be working for the Canadian government soon. He fits the bill perfectly!!! That's basically the task before him. Drai has to be signed next season. McJesus after that. The comparison for the Oil is like this upcoming season is like 2015 was to us: Even though yes, we could argue the team was hypergassed in 2016 from all the deep runs prior, in 2016 the boatanchor contracts (deserved or not) kicked in. I think this season for him pretty much has to be win or bust--I don't see Drai or McDavid taking paycuts and they still need to round out the roster. If they don't manage it this year I can't see them doing it in 2026 or beyond.
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Post by BigT on Aug 21, 2024 16:30:26 GMT -6
That above article made it sound like both were willing to sign very reasonable deals and DUMBASS did get there almost a month ago. The large-framed 22yro center and even larger framed 23yro D-man haven't shown a lot yet but neither's gotten a lot of opportunity on a fairly loaded team.....81gms for Broberg in 3 years and a paltry 11:22 of average TOI for Holloway. The #8 OA D-man was a solid +8 in his 10 PO games and the #14 OA center won over 57% of his draws last year.......both should improve with bigger roles. more than anything, the blows just offered him too much, they couldn't match that. they could've offered them sooner, but I guess they need to save every single penny for the next two summers? Draisaitl and Bouchard are going to cost here very soon and after next July 1, 97 is going to COST. That’s pretty much it. It sounds like 13.5 for Drai. I’m guessing Bouchard gets 8. So they’ll have to shed salary. I think trading EKane and trying to find a taker for Nurse would be optimal. Then they could afford a good team. Even if they have to pay a team a first rounder and retain 20% of Nurses deal. Then they should look to SJ. I’m sure they would take the bounty!!!
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