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Post by nighbor on Aug 27, 2021 1:13:34 GMT -6
Being critical of management and coaching decisiions is part of being a fan. You do not get to rewrite history. Q did not do anything special in 2013 and 2015 to earn extra credits. It is common practice in every sport for management and coaches to get together periodically to evaluate the team needs. Choosing the target is the easy part. At the TDL many teams set their sights on the same target and landing the target is where Stan has excelled. It wasn't until after the Nashville debacle when his job was on the line that Stan asserted his authority and made changes in a effort to make the Blackhawks more phusical and harder to play against. Did you just say a HC winning two cups in three years is "not doing anything special"? I don't understand this kind of thinking......this is the epitome of a defeatist mentality. Q's been gone for three years for God's sake and Harry Potter's three over in the span...........anything special? Did Stan "excel" in losing Danault? Asserted his authority? He got Rocky and McD's permission after Scotty convinced Rocky that nepotism is the way to go......I give you 'Prince Daniel'.......the 2017 'Liquor executive of the year' and now the visionary who'll redefine hockey in Chicago. More physical and harder to play against? We must watch different teams my friend. You want to see physical and hard to paly against.....check out a Panthers game! I take ZERO exception with anyone posting positive assessments of acquired players or our own prospects or the season to come and I stay out of the conversations if I disagree but you're the one re-writing history in defense of SB and the last three failed seasons. I was replying to Big T and I simply pointed out that Stan and Q in 2013 and 2015 both did their jobs and Q does not get extra credits for doing his. As far as my excelling point after Q chose the target Stan excelled in landing them (Vermette etc.). Stan has never claimed to be clairvoyant and after drafting Danault in 2011 he spent two more years in the QMJHL before going to Rockford. He appeared in 32 games for the Blackhawks 1g4a. His point totals do not scream star or show what kind of player he could be. In the Danault case there is enough blame to go around. The GM has the authority to fire and hire coaches and trade players. I am continually amazed at you and Big T knowing exactly what is said behind closed doors without a backdoor pass or being a fly on the wall. Stan did try to get a team harder to ply against but with the exception of Ulf Samuelson the HC and other coaches were the same. That off season he added Bouma and a player we traded to Boston at the TDL and added Franzen a 6-5, 230+ pound d-man. To my memory I did not touch on the JC years therefore I have not tried to re-write history. |
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Post by nighbor on Aug 27, 2021 1:26:32 GMT -6
Being critical of management and coaching decisiions is part of being a fan. You do not get to rewrite history. Q did not do anything special in 2013 and 2015 to earn extra credits. It is common practice in every sport for management and coaches to get together periodically to evaluate the team needs. Choosing the target is the easy part. At the TDL many teams set their sights on the same target and landing the target is where Stan has excelled. It wasn't until after the Nashville debacle when his job was on the line that Stan asserted his authority and made changes in a effort to make the Blackhawks more phusical and harder to play against. Disagree. Q's coaching won the 2015 series against Anaheim. And after the Nashville debacle, the 'hawks got *easier* to play against if anything. Q, Stan, and JC all share culpability in that...not to mention any player iced not named Corey Crawford in the 2018 season. I would give more credit to the players than the coach as they were the ones against Anaheim who were being physically punished and refused to quit. They were the ones worked their ass off against Tanoa to keep the finals low scoring. When Stan tried to make the team harder to play against Q was still coach so for that year at least Q was the lone culphert. |
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Post by BigT on Aug 27, 2021 7:07:46 GMT -6
Did you just say a HC winning two cups in three years is "not doing anything special"? I don't understand this kind of thinking......this is the epitome of a defeatist mentality. Q's been gone for three years for God's sake and Harry Potter's three over in the span...........anything special? Did Stan "excel" in losing Danault? Asserted his authority? He got Rocky and McD's permission after Scotty convinced Rocky that nepotism is the way to go......I give you 'Prince Daniel'.......the 2017 'Liquor executive of the year' and now the visionary who'll redefine hockey in Chicago. More physical and harder to play against? We must watch different teams my friend. You want to see physical and hard to paly against.....check out a Panthers game! I take ZERO exception with anyone posting positive assessments of acquired players or our own prospects or the season to come and I stay out of the conversations if I disagree but you're the one re-writing history in defense of SB and the last three failed seasons. I was replying to Big T and I simply pointed out that Stan and Q in 2013 and 2015 both did their jobs and Q does not get extra credits for doing his. As far as my excelling point after Q chose the target Stan excelled in landing them (Vermette etc.). Stan has never claimed to be clairvoyant and after drafting Danault in 2011 he spent two more years in the QMJHL before going to Rockford. He appeared in 32 games for the Blackhawks 1g4a. His point totals do not scream star or show what kind of player he could be. In the Danault case there is enough blame to go around. The GM has the authority to fire and hire coaches and trade players. I am continually amazed at you and Big T knowing exactly what is said behind closed doors without a backdoor pass or being a fly on the wall. Stan did try to get a team harder to ply against but with the exception of Ulf Samuelson the HC and other coaches were the same. That off season he added Bouma and a player we traded to Boston at the TDL and added Franzen a 6-5, 230+ pound d-man. To my memory I did not touch on the JC years therefore I have not tried to re-write history. Those teams were soooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo deep, the only trade that helped at all was Oduya. They would a won without any other moves. Hossa was just that good, Keith and Seabs were at their best, then Hammer and Oduya allowed Q to shorten the bench if he had too. Plus Crawford was absolutely National League. That’s what won the Cups. Without that defensive wall and getting the pucks up to the forward group, it almost looked easy. Scambo didn’t have to do much. And good for him for having everything laid out for him. But the farm team was shit for over a decade under him, drafting was dismal at best. And his trades rarely ever worked out. That’s why the team is where they are. History is the best teacher. Try it sometime!!! |
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Post by hsbob on Aug 27, 2021 7:13:42 GMT -6
Did you just say a HC winning two cups in three years is "not doing anything special"? I don't understand this kind of thinking......this is the epitome of a defeatist mentality. Q's been gone for three years for God's sake and Harry Potter's three over in the span...........anything special? Did Stan "excel" in losing Danault? Asserted his authority? He got Rocky and McD's permission after Scotty convinced Rocky that nepotism is the way to go......I give you 'Prince Daniel'.......the 2017 'Liquor executive of the year' and now the visionary who'll redefine hockey in Chicago. More physical and harder to play against? We must watch different teams my friend. You want to see physical and hard to paly against.....check out a Panthers game! I take ZERO exception with anyone posting positive assessments of acquired players or our own prospects or the season to come and I stay out of the conversations if I disagree but you're the one re-writing history in defense of SB and the last three failed seasons. I was replying to Big T and I simply pointed out that Stan and Q in 2013 and 2015 both did their jobs and Q does not get extra credits for doing his. As far as my excelling point after Q chose the target Stan excelled in landing them (Vermette etc.). Stan has never claimed to be clairvoyant and after drafting Danault in 2011 he spent two more years in the QMJHL before going to Rockford. He appeared in 32 games for the Blackhawks 1g4a. His point totals do not scream star or show what kind of player he could be. In the Danault case there is enough blame to go around. The GM has the authority to fire and hire coaches and trade players. I am continually amazed at you and Big T knowing exactly what is said behind closed doors without a backdoor pass or being a fly on the wall. Stan did try to get a team harder to ply against but with the exception of Ulf Samuelson the HC and other coaches were the same. That off season he added Bouma and a player we traded to Boston at the TDL and added Franzen a 6-5, 230+ pound d-man. To my memory I did not touch on the JC years therefore I have not tried to re-write history. If winning two cups in three years doesn't get a HC any "extra credit" in your opinion,what does? I gave SB plenty of credit back then for Richards in the offseason,for adding ADJ(who added quite a bit in the PO's)and the Vermette trade helped put the team over the top. I also mentioned drafted guys like Saad,Shaw and Kruger who were all instrumental in the last two cups back when I was in SB's corner and I was in his corner because he was doing his job well. Q and SB both deserve extra credit for both the last two cups if you ask me.
I recall Danault coming up after the half way point in '16' and then playing in 32 straight games for Q even though he had 1 goal because Q saw the benefit of his defensive play........especially with a guy like Boland gone. Did Q want him traded for the two tired vets? None of us know for sure as far as the fly on the wall goes but when a GM makes a trade,he owns it regardless of who's input he received........the GM makes the final decision.
As far as 17-18,Bouma,Wingles and Hayden were a very heavy,VERY physical(all three we on pace for 200 hits an all three had a handful of goals at the half-way point too))line that Q was using quite a bit and then BOOM. Bouma and Hayden sent down along with Franzen to help JC down in Rockford(only the GM could make these personnel moves,we know the HC liked his 4th line) and Wingles bounced around the lineup after that line was blown up. These guys DID help the Hogs be more physical and hard to play against though,I went out to a Hogs PO game that spring and it was a Beaut.
Yes,it was the players who withstood the physical onslaught in the '15' WCF but the Hawks dished it out too,Bickell might have led that series in hits BUT it was Q who had Boudreau's head about to explode........I still remember an in-game interview with BB where he said "they're changing lines pretty quick over there" .......BB was out-coached!
We agree on little my friend but you debate like a gentleman and I appreciate that!
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Post by hsbob on Aug 27, 2021 7:50:17 GMT -6
I was replying to Big T and I simply pointed out that Stan and Q in 2013 and 2015 both did their jobs and Q does not get extra credits for doing his. As far as my excelling point after Q chose the target Stan excelled in landing them (Vermette etc.). Stan has never claimed to be clairvoyant and after drafting Danault in 2011 he spent two more years in the QMJHL before going to Rockford. He appeared in 32 games for the Blackhawks 1g4a. His point totals do not scream star or show what kind of player he could be. In the Danault case there is enough blame to go around. The GM has the authority to fire and hire coaches and trade players. I am continually amazed at you and Big T knowing exactly what is said behind closed doors without a backdoor pass or being a fly on the wall. Stan did try to get a team harder to ply against but with the exception of Ulf Samuelson the HC and other coaches were the same. That off season he added Bouma and a player we traded to Boston at the TDL and added Franzen a 6-5, 230+ pound d-man. To my memory I did not touch on the JC years therefore I have not tried to re-write history. Those teams were soooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo deep, the only trade that helped at all was Oduya. They would a won without any other moves. Hossa was just that good, Keith and Seabs were at their best, then Hammer and Oduya allowed Q to shorten the bench if he had too. Plus Crawford was absolutely National League. That’s what won the Cups. Without that defensive wall and getting the pucks up to the forward group, it almost looked easy. Scambo didn’t have to do much. And good for him for having everything laid out for him. But the farm team was shit for over a decade under him, drafting was dismal at best. And his trades rarely ever worked out. That’s why the team is where they are. History is the best teacher. Try it sometime!!! I know you recall from our debates back then that I gave SB credit for Oduya,Roszival and Handzus in '13' because they all played an important role and Richards,Vermette and ADJ in '15' because they all played an important role too and I still do T,SB draft picks Saad,Shaw and Kruger were also very important in both cups. Q also gets major kudos for both cups! It was Q who had the Boland line out late against the Bruins and told em to "STAY OUT THERE" after the game tying goal. I know CC was a beast in the '15' SCF but the line of Shaw,Kruger and ADJ was used MASTERFULLY. Some criticized SB for not adding to the '17' team at the TDL and I disagreed at the time but that team obviously did need help because the cup winners were a bit worn out from winnin' cups. I started to turn against our GM after he sent down the team's most physical players and not bringing in an actual NHL goaltender that year,these things happened after CC went down and the GM punted on the season......I believe the team held a spot when CC went down too. Watching 1st rounder after 1st rounder being moved and spending sprees gone awry ever since the last cup along with one of the game's GOAT HC's being replaced with an inexperienced boob has convinced me SB's 'best by' date was a few years back! I know I mention the disastrous summer of '19' a lot but the Shaw trade still haunts the team with his cap hit keeping it at the ceiling. The Habs KNEW they were moving damaged goods yet they retained none of his 3.9MX3 and they got a 2nd and a 3rd to boot.....just an awful trade! Retained money to move Maata after only one year and deHAAN is the gift that keeps on giving. Now,even SB's supporters are leaving Beaudin and Mitchell out of projected lineups for the upcoming season,these 1st round picks are now 22 and may indeed go the way of the 1st round picks before them. Let's hope THIS spending spree and mortgaging of the future returns the team to relevance......it should be SB's swan song if it doesn't IMO. |
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Post by OldTimeHawky on Aug 27, 2021 10:37:39 GMT -6
I know you recall from our debates back then that I gave SB credit for Oduya,Roszival and Handzus in '13' because they all played an important role and Richards,Vermette and ADJ in '15' because they all played an important role too and I still do T,SB draft picks Saad,Shaw and Kruger were also very important in both cups. Q also gets major kudos for both cups! It was Q who had the Boland line out late against the Bruins and told em to "STAY OUT THERE" after the game tying goal. I know CC was a beast in the '15' SCF but the line of Shaw,Kruger and ADJ was used MASTERFULLY. Some criticized SB for not adding to the '17' team at the TDL and I disagreed at the time but that team obviously did need help because the cup winners were a bit worn out from winnin' cups. I started to turn against our GM after he sent down the team's most physical players and not bringing in an actual NHL goaltender that year,these things happened after CC went down and the GM punted on the season......I believe the team held a spot when CC went down too. Watching 1st rounder after 1st rounder being moved and spending sprees gone awry every since the last cup along with one of the games GOAT HC's being replaced with an inexperienced boob has convinced me SB's 'best by' date was a few years back! I know I mention the disastrous summer of '19' a lot but the Shaw trade still haunts the team with his cap hit keeping it at the ceiling. The Habs KNEW they were moving damaged goods yet they retained none of his 3.9MX3 and they got a 2nd and a 3rd to boot.....just an awful trade! Retained money to move Maata after only one year and deHAAN is the gift that keeps on giving. Now,even SB's supporters are leaving Beaudin and Mitchell out of projected lineups for the upcoming season,these 1st round picks are now 22 and may indeed go the way of the 1st round picks before them. Let's hope THIS spending spree and mortgaging of the future returns the team to relevance......it should be SB's swan song if it doesn't IMO. I agree with everything except Mitchell was drafted in the 2nd round, but considering he was groomed to be a top4 dman it seems like he's now Rockford bound. It's annoying how many times Stan gave up on drafted players, especially 1st rounders, except Boqvist who should've never been picked over Dobson or Bouchard, but it doesn't make sense not giving most of them time to mature. I'm sure Edmonton is glad they didn't trade Nurse when most of their fans wanted him gone. Since the Dach draft they've been drafting bigger guys, lets hope they can develop in the system and get a fair chance. But you're right, if they can't become relevant next season Stan needs to go. |
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Post by LordKOTL on Aug 27, 2021 11:52:25 GMT -6
Disagree. Q's coaching won the 2015 series against Anaheim. And after the Nashville debacle, the 'hawks got *easier* to play against if anything. Q, Stan, and JC all share culpability in that...not to mention any player iced not named Corey Crawford in the 2018 season. I would give more credit to the players than the coach as they were the ones against Anaheim who were being physically punished and refused to quit. They were the ones worked their ass off against Tanoa to keep the finals low scoring. When Stan tried to make the team harder to play against Q was still coach so for that year at least Q was the lone culphert. No matter how Boudreau stacked his lines against Chicago's Q always had the answer in terms of player deployment. I'm not discounting the players (especially Keith) in that series, but Q clearly outcoached Boudreau. |
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Post by gigecj on Aug 27, 2021 15:36:05 GMT -6
lame on Jammer, but I won't miss Konroyd. he was ok between periods, but I hated when he took Eddie's spot. I agree that Konroyd is subpar. No, it wasn't really his lack of expertise (although that didn't bowl me over), it was that he was dull. I never looked forward to anything he said because his analysis was merely ok and devoid of any enthusiasm and color. Compare him to Eddie O in this comparison and it is no contest in my book. |
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Post by OldTimeHawky on Aug 27, 2021 16:26:27 GMT -6
lame on Jammer, but I won't miss Konroyd. he was ok between periods, but I hated when he took Eddie's spot. I agree that Konroyd is subpar. No, it wasn't really his lack of expertise (although that didn't bowl me over), it was that he was dull. I never looked forward to anything he said because his analysis was merely ok and devoid of any enthusiasm and color. Compare him to Eddie O in this comparison and it is no contest in my book. Exactly, he was humourless and the past couple years it seemed like he tried but failed at showing emotion. But one thing I didn't like about EddieO was that he wouldn't shut up during the play, if it was the radio you'd think the ref took forever to drop the puck, nope, game on and Eddie was still rambling on. |
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Post by hsbob on Aug 27, 2021 16:40:05 GMT -6
I know you recall from our debates back then that I gave SB credit for Oduya,Roszival and Handzus in '13' because they all played an important role and Richards,Vermette and ADJ in '15' because they all played an important role too and I still do T,SB draft picks Saad,Shaw and Kruger were also very important in both cups. Q also gets major kudos for both cups! It was Q who had the Boland line out late against the Bruins and told em to "STAY OUT THERE" after the game tying goal. I know CC was a beast in the '15' SCF but the line of Shaw,Kruger and ADJ was used MASTERFULLY. Some criticized SB for not adding to the '17' team at the TDL and I disagreed at the time but that team obviously did need help because the cup winners were a bit worn out from winnin' cups. I started to turn against our GM after he sent down the team's most physical players and not bringing in an actual NHL goaltender that year,these things happened after CC went down and the GM punted on the season......I believe the team held a spot when CC went down too. Watching 1st rounder after 1st rounder being moved and spending sprees gone awry every since the last cup along with one of the games GOAT HC's being replaced with an inexperienced boob has convinced me SB's 'best by' date was a few years back! I know I mention the disastrous summer of '19' a lot but the Shaw trade still haunts the team with his cap hit keeping it at the ceiling. The Habs KNEW they were moving damaged goods yet they retained none of his 3.9MX3 and they got a 2nd and a 3rd to boot.....just an awful trade! Retained money to move Maata after only one year and deHAAN is the gift that keeps on giving. Now,even SB's supporters are leaving Beaudin and Mitchell out of projected lineups for the upcoming season,these 1st round picks are now 22 and may indeed go the way of the 1st round picks before them. Let's hope THIS spending spree and mortgaging of the future returns the team to relevance......it should be SB's swan song if it doesn't IMO. I agree with everything except Mitchell was drafted in the 2nd round, but considering he was groomed to be a top4 dman it seems like he's now Rockford bound. It's annoying how many times Stan gave up on drafted players, especially 1st rounders, except Boqvist who should've never been picked over Dobson or Bouchard, but it doesn't make sense not giving most of them time to mature. I'm sure Edmonton is glad they didn't trade Nurse when most of their fans wanted him gone. Since the Dach draft they've been drafting bigger guys, lets hope they can develop in the system and get a fair chance. But you're right, if they can't become relevant next season Stan needs to go. Then who were the two D-men taken in the same 1st round.......Boqvist and Beaudin? It's hard to keep track some times. |
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Post by galaxytrash on Aug 27, 2021 17:39:45 GMT -6
twitter tells me training camp opens 1 month from today.
it's going to be a long one....
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Post by OldTimeHawky on Aug 27, 2021 19:45:00 GMT -6
Then who were the two D-men taken in the same 1st round.......Boqvist and Beaudin? It's hard to keep track some times. Those are the two. Hawks drafted a lot of small dmen around that time, I can see why it's hard to keep track. |
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Post by Tater on Aug 28, 2021 0:12:04 GMT -6
Exactly, he was humourless and the past couple years it seemed like he tried but failed at showing emotion. But one thing I didn't like about EddieO was that he wouldn't shut up during the play, if it was the radio you'd think the ref took forever to drop the puck, nope, game on and Eddie was still rambling on. Man, I couldn't have said it better (both thoughts).
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Post by hsbob on Aug 28, 2021 8:47:51 GMT -6
I like Pat and Edzo but too many giggle fests in a row made me appreciate the occasional drollness of Konroyd for a game but just a game. I didn't really mind him in between periods though.....Jammer either to be honest.
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Post by T-man2010 on Aug 28, 2021 10:01:46 GMT -6
For the old days.....
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Post by gigecj on Aug 28, 2021 17:12:00 GMT -6
...and isn't the Blackhawk World a much better place ever since JC came to the rescue?
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Post by mvr on Aug 28, 2021 21:20:48 GMT -6
Training camp starts in a month, and the Hawks remain very top heavy at forward, especially in top six skill types who play on the powerplay.
I still believe at least one guy will be gone, and Strome is the most likely candidate.
There have been rumours about Ottawa liking Strome, but Montreal all of a sudden might be interested They are already down one centre, Danault, and they soon could be losing the young Finn to Carolina.
Here is a potential offer - Strome and Mitchell/Beaudin for Guhle and Poehling.
Montreal adds a legit centre to their roster and a young defencemen. Chicago gets a better all round defence prospect and a fringe bottom six forward more suited to what the team needs.
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Post by bigbarn27 on Aug 28, 2021 22:10:22 GMT -6
twitter tells me training camp opens 1 month from today. it's going to be a long one.... Will there be a prospect camp? will there be anything at travers City ? |
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Post by nighbor on Aug 28, 2021 23:03:36 GMT -6
I was replying to Big T and I simply pointed out that Stan and Q in 2013 and 2015 both did their jobs and Q does not get extra credits for doing his. As far as my excelling point after Q chose the target Stan excelled in landing them (Vermette etc.). Stan has never claimed to be clairvoyant and after drafting Danault in 2011 he spent two more years in the QMJHL before going to Rockford. He appeared in 32 games for the Blackhawks 1g4a. His point totals do not scream star or show what kind of player he could be. In the Danault case there is enough blame to go around. The GM has the authority to fire and hire coaches and trade players. I am continually amazed at you and Big T knowing exactly what is said behind closed doors without a backdoor pass or being a fly on the wall. Stan did try to get a team harder to ply against but with the exception of Ulf Samuelson the HC and other coaches were the same. That off season he added Bouma and a player we traded to Boston at the TDL and added Franzen a 6-5, 230+ pound d-man. To my memory I did not touch on the JC years therefore I have not tried to re-write history. I gave SB plenty of credit back then for Richards in the offseason,for adding ADJ(who added quite a bit in the PO's)and the Vermette trade helped put the team over the top. I also mentioned drafted guys like Saad,Shaw and Kruger who were all instrumental in the last two cups back when I was in SB's corner and I was in his corner because he was doing his job well. Q and SB both deserve extra credit for both the last two cups if you ask me.
I recall Danault coming up after the half way point in '16' and then playing in 32 straight games for Q even though he had 1 goal because Q saw the benefit of his defensive play........especially with a guy like Boland gone. Did Q want him traded for the two tired vets? None of us know for sure as far as the fly on the wall goes but when a GM makes a trade,he owns it regardless of who's input he received........the GM makes the final decision.
As far as 17-18,Bouma,Wingles and Hayden were a very heavy,VERY physical(all three we on pace for 200 hits an all three had a handful of goals at the half-way point too))line that Q was using quite a bit and then BOOM. Bouma and Hayden sent down along with Franzen to help JC down in Rockford(only the GM could make these personnel moves,we know the HC liked his 4th line) and Wingles bounced around the lineup after that line was blown up. These guys DID help the Hogs be more physical and hard to play against though,I went out to a Hogs PO game that spring and it was a Beaut.
Yes,it was the players who withstood the physical onslaught in the '15' WCF but the Hawks dished it out too,Bickell might have led that series in hits BUT it was Q who had Boudreau's head about to explode........I still remember an in-game interview with BB where he said "they're changing lines pretty quick over there" .......BB was out-coached!
We agree on little my friend but you debate like a gentleman and I appreciate that!
Nothing. Not even his 3 in 6. Every year is different and every year he had the job of outcoaching other coaches and putting his players in position to win. He will get his extra credit when he enters the hall for his body of work. There are millions upon millions of everyday people get up, go to work and do their job to the best of their ability without the expectation of extra credits. Why should Q. |
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Post by galaxytrash on Aug 28, 2021 23:39:42 GMT -6
twitter tells me training camp opens 1 month from today. it's going to be a long one.... Will there be a prospect camp? will there be anything at travers City ? the hawks pulled out of the traverse tourney, not sure why. covid maybe? idk about prospect camp. i thought there would just be a main camp but i'm not 100% sure on that one. |
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Post by OldTimeHawky on Aug 28, 2021 23:58:17 GMT -6
Will there be a prospect camp? will there be anything at travers City ? the hawks pulled out of the traverse tourney, not sure why. covid maybe? idk about prospect camp. i thought there would just be a main camp but i'm not 100% sure on that one. Maybe because Dach suffered a concussion in the last tournament. I'm sure Covid played a part as well. No point in having a prospect injured or getting sick in a meaningless tourney. |
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Post by galaxytrash on Aug 29, 2021 3:15:06 GMT -6
If winning two cups in three years doesn't get a HC any "extra credit" in your opinion,what does? I gave SB plenty of credit back then for Richards in the offseason,for adding ADJ(who added quite a bit in the PO's)and the Vermette trade helped put the team over the top. I also mentioned drafted guys like Saad,Shaw and Kruger who were all instrumental in the last two cups back when I was in SB's corner and I was in his corner because he was doing his job well. Q and SB both deserve extra credit for both the last two cups if you ask me.
I recall Danault coming up after the half way point in '16' and then playing in 32 straight games for Q even though he had 1 goal because Q saw the benefit of his defensive play........especially with a guy like Boland gone. Did Q want him traded for the two tired vets? None of us know for sure as far as the fly on the wall goes but when a GM makes a trade,he owns it regardless of who's input he received........the GM makes the final decision.
As far as 17-18,Bouma,Wingles and Hayden were a very heavy,VERY physical(all three we on pace for 200 hits an all three had a handful of goals at the half-way point too))line that Q was using quite a bit and then BOOM. Bouma and Hayden sent down along with Franzen to help JC down in Rockford(only the GM could make these personnel moves,we know the HC liked his 4th line) and Wingles bounced around the lineup after that line was blown up. These guys DID help the Hogs be more physical and hard to play against though,I went out to a Hogs PO game that spring and it was a Beaut.
Yes,it was the players who withstood the physical onslaught in the '15' WCF but the Hawks dished it out too,Bickell might have led that series in hits BUT it was Q who had Boudreau's head about to explode........I still remember an in-game interview with BB where he said "they're changing lines pretty quick over there" .......BB was out-coached!
We agree on little my friend but you debate like a gentleman and I appreciate that!
Nothing. Not even his 3 in 6. Every year is different and every year he had the job of outcoaching other coaches and putting his players in position to win. He will get his extra credit when he enters the hall for his body of work. There are millions upon millions of everyday people get up, go to work and do their job to the best of their ability without the expectation of extra credits. Why should Q. tough crowd. : ) |
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Post by hsbob on Aug 29, 2021 8:22:58 GMT -6
If winning two cups in three years doesn't get a HC any "extra credit" in your opinion,what does? I gave SB plenty of credit back then for Richards in the offseason,for adding ADJ(who added quite a bit in the PO's)and the Vermette trade helped put the team over the top. I also mentioned drafted guys like Saad,Shaw and Kruger who were all instrumental in the last two cups back when I was in SB's corner and I was in his corner because he was doing his job well. Q and SB both deserve extra credit for both the last two cups if you ask me.
I recall Danault coming up after the half way point in '16' and then playing in 32 straight games for Q even though he had 1 goal because Q saw the benefit of his defensive play........especially with a guy like Boland gone. Did Q want him traded for the two tired vets? None of us know for sure as far as the fly on the wall goes but when a GM makes a trade,he owns it regardless of who's input he received........the GM makes the final decision.
As far as 17-18,Bouma,Wingles and Hayden were a very heavy,VERY physical(all three we on pace for 200 hits an all three had a handful of goals at the half-way point too))line that Q was using quite a bit and then BOOM. Bouma and Hayden sent down along with Franzen to help JC down in Rockford(only the GM could make these personnel moves,we know the HC liked his 4th line) and Wingles bounced around the lineup after that line was blown up. These guys DID help the Hogs be more physical and hard to play against though,I went out to a Hogs PO game that spring and it was a Beaut.
Yes,it was the players who withstood the physical onslaught in the '15' WCF but the Hawks dished it out too,Bickell might have led that series in hits BUT it was Q who had Boudreau's head about to explode........I still remember an in-game interview with BB where he said "they're changing lines pretty quick over there" .......BB was out-coached!
We agree on little my friend but you debate like a gentleman and I appreciate that!
Nothing. Not even his 3 in 6. Every year is different and every year he had the job of outcoaching other coaches and putting his players in position to win. He will get his extra credit when he enters the hall for his body of work. There are millions upon millions of everyday people get up, go to work and do their job to the best of their ability without the expectation of extra credits. Why should Q. Breaking the SOUL CRUSHING forty nine year drought was obviously more important to some of us than it was to others but then again......I lived through all of em. |
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Post by BigT on Aug 29, 2021 9:01:25 GMT -6
If winning two cups in three years doesn't get a HC any "extra credit" in your opinion,what does? I gave SB plenty of credit back then for Richards in the offseason,for adding ADJ(who added quite a bit in the PO's)and the Vermette trade helped put the team over the top. I also mentioned drafted guys like Saad,Shaw and Kruger who were all instrumental in the last two cups back when I was in SB's corner and I was in his corner because he was doing his job well. Q and SB both deserve extra credit for both the last two cups if you ask me.
I recall Danault coming up after the half way point in '16' and then playing in 32 straight games for Q even though he had 1 goal because Q saw the benefit of his defensive play........especially with a guy like Boland gone. Did Q want him traded for the two tired vets? None of us know for sure as far as the fly on the wall goes but when a GM makes a trade,he owns it regardless of who's input he received........the GM makes the final decision.
As far as 17-18,Bouma,Wingles and Hayden were a very heavy,VERY physical(all three we on pace for 200 hits an all three had a handful of goals at the half-way point too))line that Q was using quite a bit and then BOOM. Bouma and Hayden sent down along with Franzen to help JC down in Rockford(only the GM could make these personnel moves,we know the HC liked his 4th line) and Wingles bounced around the lineup after that line was blown up. These guys DID help the Hogs be more physical and hard to play against though,I went out to a Hogs PO game that spring and it was a Beaut.
Yes,it was the players who withstood the physical onslaught in the '15' WCF but the Hawks dished it out too,Bickell might have led that series in hits BUT it was Q who had Boudreau's head about to explode........I still remember an in-game interview with BB where he said "they're changing lines pretty quick over there" .......BB was out-coached!
We agree on little my friend but you debate like a gentleman and I appreciate that!
Nothing. Not even his 3 in 6. Every year is different and every year he had the job of outcoaching other coaches and putting his players in position to win. He will get his extra credit when he enters the hall for his body of work. There are millions upon millions of everyday people get up, go to work and do their job to the best of their ability without the expectation of extra credits. Why should Q. Because Q is possibly the best ever at his job. If not best, 2nd best. If you’re the best janitor ever, no one unfortunately may ever hear about you. Why? Because although it’s a necessary job, it’s not entertainment. That’s all sports are is just entertainment. It goes off of supply and demand. Just like anything else. Q is in demand for his services, and he makes a massive amount for it. Ol Scambo’s services are not really in demand. They weren’t when he was hired. You’re taking the dangerous assumption that if Scambo wasn’t hired, there’d never have been any Cups at all. The first Cup in 2010, Stan did nothing but get a concussed Swedish dude that never played. And he also botched the draft that year. His moves cost the team dearly and they sucked for a couple years till Q finally got in his contract that he had final say over the roster. And that’s a fact. There are interviews with Q stating that he wanted final say and control of his own destiny. Scambo kept giving him worse and worse players, Q just never used them. Trading Danault was horrible at best. Q didn’t use either of the guys he got. That’s called mismanagement. Q was using Danault regularly and then he got traded for nothing. I don’t think you fully understand how a team runs? The importance of every person from the trainers to equipment guys all the way to the top. Scambo doesn’t understand sports. Listen to the guy talk. If you honestly think he talks intelligently about the sport he’s employed in, I have a glacier to sell you. Listen to other GMs talk. They sound totally different than him. Why? Because they played and understand the sport from the trainers all the way to the owner. Not one of them have Scambo’s degree on the wall. Why? Because it’s clearly not needed for this line of work. A GM needs to understand how the team works. The chemistry, of the whole team, not just the players. The trainers etc. The farm team has been a disaster ever since he took over. These are not assumptions. These are facts. Once again, history is there for all to see. If you don’t learn from it, you’ll repeat it!!! |
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Post by nighbor on Aug 29, 2021 12:45:13 GMT -6
Nothing. Not even his 3 in 6. Every year is different and every year he had the job of outcoaching other coaches and putting his players in position to win. He will get his extra credit when he enters the hall for his body of work. There are millions upon millions of everyday people get up, go to work and do their job to the best of their ability without the expectation of extra credits. Why should Q. tough crowd. : ) Damn straight. |
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Post by galaxytrash on Aug 29, 2021 18:50:11 GMT -6
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Post by nighbor on Aug 29, 2021 21:41:13 GMT -6
Nothing. Not even his 3 in 6. Every year is different and every year he had the job of outcoaching other coaches and putting his players in position to win. He will get his extra credit when he enters the hall for his body of work. There are millions upon millions of everyday people get up, go to work and do their job to the best of their ability without the expectation of extra credits. Why should Q. Breaking the SOUL CRUSHING forty nine year drought was obviously more important to some of us than it was to others but then again......I lived through all of em. I have been a Blackhawk fans since ‘58 or ‘59 and I also lived through the drought but I have not put Q on a pedestal. He is a good coach who lucked into having a great team in Chicago. When you have a team with five or more superstars and as Big T, a big time poster said Chicago was sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo deep, the only trade that helped at all was Oduya (2013 and 2015 cups). They would a won without any other moves. Hossa (2010, 2013 and 2015 cups) was just that good, Keith and Seabs were at their best, then Hammer and Oduya allowed Q to shorten the bench if he had too. |
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Post by hsbob on Aug 30, 2021 6:33:03 GMT -6
Breaking the SOUL CRUSHING forty nine year drought was obviously more important to some of us than it was to others but then again......I lived through all of em. I have been a Blackhawk fans since ‘58 or ‘59 and I also lived through the drought but I have not put Q on a pedestal. He is a good coach who lucked into having a great team in Chicago. When you have a team with five or more superstars and as Big T, a big time poster said Chicago was sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo deep, the only trade that helped at all was Oduya (2013 and 2015 cups). They would a won without any other moves. Hossa (2010, 2013 and 2015 cups) was just that good, Keith and Seabs were at their best, then Hammer and Oduya allowed Q to shorten the bench if he had too. If you have a beef with Big T,take it up with him.....not me. I gave SB credit for the moves that helped win the last two cups time and time again. If you have a problem with a HC who's been gone for three years after the best stretch of hockey Chicago ever saw,that's your business but Q's considered the best active HC and one of the best HC's ever by the vast majority of hockey people. |
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Post by BigT on Aug 30, 2021 7:06:37 GMT -6
Breaking the SOUL CRUSHING forty nine year drought was obviously more important to some of us than it was to others but then again......I lived through all of em. I have been a Blackhawk fans since ‘58 or ‘59 and I also lived through the drought but I have not put Q on a pedestal. He is a good coach who lucked into having a great team in Chicago. When you have a team with five or more superstars and as Big T, a big time poster said Chicago was sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo deep, the only trade that helped at all was Oduya (2013 and 2015 cups). They would a won without any other moves. Hossa (2010, 2013 and 2015 cups) was just that good, Keith and Seabs were at their best, then Hammer and Oduya allowed Q to shorten the bench if he had too. Again, this is where I don’t think you understand hockey or sports. This is where Scambo doesn’t either. Jeremy Colliton loses with those teams. I don’t think he gets much further than the 2nd round. Q knows how to shift gears and change things up when others don’t. Boudreau was at a loss for words at how Q schooled him. The team was sooooooooooooooooooo deep, and that includes the whole team. The coaches, trainers etc were all on the same page and everyone bought in. Q was in charge of that team, there is nothing a GM can do to help or hurt the team after the TDL. The players would not have been blamed if they failed in any of those playoffs. As we seen in 2011 and 2012. Q was blamed even though the roster got decimated by Scambo’s ill informed moves. Q had to tell him exactly who he wanted and they won 2 more and almost 3. Those are all facts. We’ve discussed them here throughout the years and I’m sure you can dig up an article or 12 on them. The GM didn’t do much but forget about other assets of the team. Mainly the farm team. He left the same coach in there for 3-4 years with absolutely no progress. Ted Dent was in there. Without a strong farm team, and piss poor drafting. The team is in trouble due to it. If this current scheme that Scambo is doing doesn’t work out. It’s full rebuild this time. With no cap space or assets, the team will be doomed for a long time!!! |
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Post by hsbob on Aug 31, 2021 9:25:46 GMT -6
WBBM news radio Chicago just reported Connor Murphy extended for four years,no specifics so far.
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