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Post by BigT on Sept 5, 2021 6:36:29 GMT -6
Just like before with deHaan, McCabe is damaged goods. Does MAF get run the fuck over here? Like Crow did? I still see a lot of similarities, and Toews has said that he may not be ready for the start of the season.
Does this coach force players like Nylander (or is forced) on top players and bring down a line?
If McCabe is a bust, and it’s possible coming off those surgeries, it’s not like he was a game changer before hand. That seriously cripples the depth. And we’re stuck with pretty much what we had before, and for 4 years. So I see very cautious optimism here!!!
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Post by hsbob on Sept 5, 2021 8:53:44 GMT -6
D-Cat's defensive game improved by leaps and bounds last year,he might have been the team's most effective back-checker.......he's FAR from deficient IMO. The kid was on a 50 goal pace without Kane or Toews last year but I'd still like to see him with a good set-up man all year.......Kane and Panarin worked well and D-Cat's a better defensive player than Panarin. They did not make it out of the first round. This is not a knock on Cat its just teams can cycle the shit out of them when they are on the ice together and come playoff time teams are a lot more disciplined to do this. I love Cats transition D but kane and cat in there own end is not ideal. As you said Cat does not need 88 or 19 he can make a line go all on his own now. If this team is gonna do anything they need to be top 12 defensively. That is a tall order, im not worried about this team scoring goals. Opponents 'cycled the shit out of all our forwards' last year,D-Cat might have been the best defensive forward on the team but okay. Who do you put on Kane's off wing,Kubalik? Is he any better defensively than D-Cat? We're blessed with one of the league's best goal scorers,why not play him with one of the team's only two good set-up men(K&T)? |
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Post by hsbob on Sept 5, 2021 9:20:42 GMT -6
That’s our depth guys compared to now. Caleb Jones isn’t even an NHL player at this point, considering his age, I don’t think he will be either. The depth is probably as good as it’s been in the last 5 years. We have to think just a couple years ago we had Toews, Kane, Kubalik, Saad, Dcat, Shaw, Maatta, deHaan, Keith, Murphy, etc. Etc ETC. But I don’t know if this team is any better at this point. One last thing. I fear chemistry will be tough for the team with half a roster turned over again. This may be a 2-3 year project. Plus the coaching is not National League. So we’ll see soon enough!!! You mean Shaw who barely played because of another concussion that ended his career, Kubs was raw being a rookie, Debrincat was played on the 3rd line in a shutdown role 🙄 and all 4 dmen you mentioned are all 2nd paring dmen, yes even Keith. Plus Seabs was dealing with his injuries and a shell of himself. I've mentioned Crows concussions so I say MAF is an upgrade. And I didn't like the Keith trade because I would've rather had Broberg or Bouchard but not retaining salary for Keith and getting a pick and Caleb, which helped get his brother, looks good now. Caleb played 30+gms of the 56 last season, he does have the tools to be a good dman but he had confidence issues, maybe practicing and playing with his brother full time and a change of scenery will help get him on track. And yes there's been turnover, like all teams do, but not half the team. Murphy, Kalynuk, Stillman and de Haan are still here, McCabe is new but he's known Murph and Seth since his early teens, Caleb is a question mark but obviously knows Seth and then there's Beaudin and Mitchell who aren't new. And up front they have Kane, Debrincat, Toews, Dach, Hagel, Kubalik, Strome, Kurashev, Gaudette, Carpenter, and a few guys who played a little last season, Connelly, Entwistle, and Hardman. Nylander is questionable of course. I'm no mathematician but that's not half the team, but saying half sounds more dramatic to try and prove a point I guess. Of course I agree about the coaching though, huge question mark that concerns me. We'll soon find out how this team does on the ice. Who rounds out the top six along with Kane,Toews(when ready),D-Cat and Kubalik(who's goal scoring dropped dramatically w/o JT last year)? Who's the tough,tallented,puck retriever who can stick up for those four guys? The team is still without a proven power forward IMO. Keith and Zadarov were replaced with Jones(BIG upgrade) and McCabe(question mark at this point),I do agree with you that knee surgeries have come a long way and McCabe could easily heal and help in terms of toughness but were you serious about the 6 million for him....he's produced very little offense throughout his career. MAF is indeed an upgrade but the fact remains he lost his net to Lehner the last two years in the PO's and in both of the Pens last two cups to Murray,Crawford lost his net in the PO's once to Darling for two games before going on to lead the team to another cup.........you compared the two in a previous post as I just did. The defense should be tougher with S Jones who is a tough guy,McCabe and Stillman when he draws in and maybe Murphy too if he isn't 'too important to fight' again but where does the toughness come from up front? |
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Post by OldTimeHawky on Sept 5, 2021 10:06:14 GMT -6
Just like before with deHaan, McCabe is damaged goods. Does MAF get run the fuck over here? Like Crow did? I still see a lot of similarities, and Toews has said that he may not be ready for the start of the season. Does this coach force players like Nylander (or is forced) on top players and bring down a line? If McCabe is a bust, and it’s possible coming off those surgeries, it’s not like he was a game changer before hand. That seriously cripples the depth. And we’re stuck with pretty much what we had before, and for 4 years. So I see very cautious optimism here!!! I'd rather have McCabe over de Haan, to bad they couldn't move Calvin this off season. But if McCabe gets injured it wouldn't seriously cripple the depth, that sounds pretty drastic. It'll mean whoever's sitting will play and there'll be good players not playing, Mitchell, Beaudin, Regula, etc. Caleb, if he's not on the opening night roster, and maybe Krutil, Phillips, Krys or another kid makes big strides from last season. There's depth. It was sad how Crow got ran over by Malkin and Seabs did nothing, or when E. Kane shoved Strome into Crow after the whistle and nothing was done about it, but there's no way Gus or Keith would confront Kane. I hope with a big true #1 like Seth it won't happen again, Stan and JC both said they want this team to play tougher, we'll see. As for Nylander, after he signed his 1yr show me deal he said watching the games last season he learned a lot and he wants to be good defensively and become consistent offensively, once again, we'll see. But I doubt he'll be in the lineup if he doesn't deserve to be there. |
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Post by hsbob on Sept 5, 2021 10:34:25 GMT -6
Just like before with deHaan, McCabe is damaged goods. Does MAF get run the fuck over here? Like Crow did? I still see a lot of similarities, and Toews has said that he may not be ready for the start of the season. Does this coach force players like Nylander (or is forced) on top players and bring down a line? If McCabe is a bust, and it’s possible coming off those surgeries, it’s not like he was a game changer before hand. That seriously cripples the depth. And we’re stuck with pretty much what we had before, and for 4 years. So I see very cautious optimism here!!! I'd rather have McCabe over de Haan, to bad they couldn't move Calvin this off season. But if McCabe gets injured it wouldn't seriously cripple the depth, that sounds pretty drastic. It'll mean whoever's sitting will play and there'll be good players not playing, Mitchell, Beaudin, Regula, etc. Caleb, if he's not on the opening night roster, and maybe Krutil, Phillips, Krys or another kid makes big strides from last season. There's depth. It was sad how Crow got ran over by Malkin and Seabs did nothing, or when E. Kane shoved Strome into Crow after the whistle and nothing was done about it, but there's no way Gus or Keith would confront Kane. I hope with a big true #1 like Seth it won't happen again, Stan and JC both said they want this team to play tougher, we'll see. As for Nylander, after he signed his 1yr show me deal he said watching the games last season he learned a lot and he wants to be good defensively and become consistent offensively, once again, we'll see. But I doubt he'll be in the lineup if he doesn't deserve to be there. I do respect and appreciate your optimism and I agree the team should be better and the D tougher but are you putting this team's lack of pack mentality squarely on Seabs' shoulders.....sure sounded like it. Was it Seab's fault Murphy ran away from Maroon and Goodrow after he blew up Cernak? Maroon took it out on D-Cat and Goodrow took it out on Hagel when Murph was 'too important' to fight ? DAM SEABROOK! This mindset clearly came from the top as it has for years,Harry Potter even went to the press saying "a player shouldn't have to fight just because he hit somebody".........That is NOT "playing tougher" but it seems to be the Hawks credo. Seabs was plenty tough in the cup runs but a few concussions,a few too many small,scared partners and a team-wide failure to engage took most of that out of him. Which addition makes our forward group more physical and harder to play against........5'8" Tyler Johnson? If McCabe gets injured again? It's only 16 million....no worries. |
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Post by OldTimeHawky on Sept 5, 2021 10:44:09 GMT -6
Who rounds out the top six along with Kane,Toews(when ready),D-Cat and Kubalik(who's goal scoring dropped dramatically w/o JT last year)? Who's the tough,tallented,puck retriever who can stick up for those four guys? The team is still without a proven power forward IMO. Keith and Zadarov were replaced with Jones(BIG upgrade) and McCabe(question mark at this point),I do agree with you that knee surgeries have come a long way and McCabe could easily heal and help in terms of toughness but were you serious about the 6 million for him....he's produced very little offense throughout his career. MAF is indeed an upgrade but the fact remains he lost his net to Lehner the last two years in the PO's and in both of the Pens last two cups to Murray,Crawford lost his net in the PO's once to Darling for two games before going on to lead the team to another cup.........you compared the two in a previous post as I just did. The defense should be tougher with S Jones who is a tough guy,McCabe and Stillman when he draws in and maybe Murphy too if he isn't 'too important to fight' again but where does the toughness come from up front? Unfortunately there isn't a powerforward that'll stick up for those 4 that can play on the top6, we've talked about this before and that'll be awesome getting one. Toews and Dach are great at retrieving pucks and playing along the boards, great for guys like Debrincat, Kane,and Kubalik, but they don't fight, with Dachs wrist I hope he never fights unless he really increased his calcium intake. Toews had fought a few times but it's rare and he shouldn't have to. But there are some tough players that'll stick up for teammates like Hardman, Entwistle, Jujhar, Gaudette, Carpenter, and Hagel. Yes Hagel is under 200lbs but he proved he can fight by knocking out 6'5" Laine. And Murphy said Toews looks great on the ice and during workouts, it sounds like he'll be ready to start the season. As for MAF losing his net, last year made no sense because his last game he let in 1 bad goal and they lost 2-1, they knew that they were protecting Lehner so I guess they decided to go with the much bigger younger goalie. Fleury lost his net in Pittsburgh because a 6'4" rookie played lights out, the next Cup he took over when Murray was injured and when Matt was healthy they went with him because they knew he was the future because once again one goalie had to be protected. Our GM and coach both stated they want this team to play tougher, I hope that's true. |
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Post by galaxytrash on Sept 5, 2021 20:11:31 GMT -6
Who rounds out the top six along with Kane,Toews(when ready),D-Cat and Kubalik(who's goal scoring dropped dramatically w/o JT last year)? Who's the tough,tallented,puck retriever who can stick up for those four guys? The team is still without a proven power forward IMO. Keith and Zadarov were replaced with Jones(BIG upgrade) and McCabe(question mark at this point),I do agree with you that knee surgeries have come a long way and McCabe could easily heal and help in terms of toughness but were you serious about the 6 million for him....he's produced very little offense throughout his career. MAF is indeed an upgrade but the fact remains he lost his net to Lehner the last two years in the PO's and in both of the Pens last two cups to Murray,Crawford lost his net in the PO's once to Darling for two games before going on to lead the team to another cup.........you compared the two in a previous post as I just did. The defense should be tougher with S Jones who is a tough guy,McCabe and Stillman when he draws in and maybe Murphy too if he isn't 'too important to fight' again but where does the toughness come from up front? Yes Hagel is under 200lbs but he proved he can fight by knocking out 6'5" Laine. kind of fitting this shows up today on twitter. |
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Post by OldTimeHawky on Sept 6, 2021 0:40:14 GMT -6
^ Great timing, he fought like Domi, duck and hold on then throw a haymaker. Good accuracy and timing, love this kids heart. And loved seeing Laines legs buckle, 2 huge rights.
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Post by Tater on Sept 6, 2021 2:34:45 GMT -6
Yes Hagel is under 200lbs but he proved he can fight by knocking out 6'5" Laine. kind of fitting this shows up today on twitter. Oh how that made me smile! |
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Post by galaxytrash on Sept 6, 2021 3:17:48 GMT -6
kind of fitting this shows up today on twitter. Oh how that made me smile! Laine left a few marks on our guy but i'm sure they would've buffed right off. (from the back of hagel's helmet) |
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Post by hsbob on Sept 6, 2021 8:43:01 GMT -6
No bigger Hagel guy than me all summer,I called for his re-do when some others said he should go if he won't sign cheap but here we are again looking to a 174lb F'ing kid to settle the team's hash. Hagle also took a bad,late hit from Goodrow when the bigger Murphy refused to answer but hey.....he's a tough Lil Dude like Shaw and Caggulia and who else will protect him?
Khaira is a big guy who will fight but he's also a 27yro player with 24 career goals,in other words,another big,tough guy who isn't very talented and was added as an afterthought. We can always add size later I've been told for years' and that's exactly what happened with him. Will he even draw in most of the time with the number of forwards on the roster and will he be as physical as he's been in the past when he does? He also took a nasty KO from Ritchie last time he 'went' and needed help off the ice due to it,he might be happy if he isn't asked to do that here after his last tilt.
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Post by BigT on Sept 6, 2021 9:36:02 GMT -6
No bigger Hagel guy than me all summer,I called for his re-do when some others said he should go if he won't sign cheap but here we are again looking to a 174lb F'ing kid to settle the team's hash. Hagle also took a bad,late hit from Goodrow when the bigger Murphy refused to answer but hey.....he's a tough Lil Dude like Shaw and Caggulia and who else will protect him? Khaira is a big guy who will fight but he's also a 27yro player with 24 career goals,in other words,another big,tough guy who isn't very talented and was added as an afterthought. We can always add size later I've been told for years' and that's exactly what happened with him. Will he even draw in most of the time with the number of forwards on the roster and will he be as physical as he's been in the past when he does? He also took a nasty KO from Ritchie last time he 'went' and needed help off the ice due to it,he might be happy if he isn't asked to do that here after his last tilt. I like Hagel. I just hope that there’s room for a guy like him. I’m not against smaller players. But c’mon Hawks. Kane, Hagel, Dcat, Johnson, Beaudin, Mitchell, etc etc. Just too many smaller guys or underweight guys. I doubt they make a tone of difference over 4 rounds. Kane did well when he had size with him and he didn’t have to dig for pucks. I do agree that size has been added. But old habits die hard. I also fear that the style of play needs to do a complete 180. Need to be more physical and stick up for each other. Anyone runs the goalie, they should be speared and not spared!!! |
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Post by OldTimeHawky on Sept 6, 2021 14:27:20 GMT -6
No bigger Hagel guy than me all summer,I called for his re-do when some others said he should go if he won't sign cheap but here we are again looking to a 174lb F'ing kid to settle the team's hash. Hagle also took a bad,late hit from Goodrow when the bigger Murphy refused to answer but hey.....he's a tough Lil Dude like Shaw and Caggulia and who else will protect him? Khaira is a big guy who will fight but he's also a 27yro player with 24 career goals,in other words,another big,tough guy who isn't very talented and was added as an afterthought. We can always add size later I've been told for years' and that's exactly what happened with him. Will he even draw in most of the time with the number of forwards on the roster and will he be as physical as he's been in the past when he does? He also took a nasty KO from Ritchie last time he 'went' and needed help off the ice due to it,he might be happy if he isn't asked to do that here after his last tilt. I might be a bigger fan but it's not a competition lol I started a Hagel thread after he signed his intial contract in 2018 and updated his stats after every game. Watching the highlights during his last season in Red Deer I became a huge fan, especially with Brent Sutter talking so highly of him. But it's funny how Red Deer had him listed at 6'1" 173lbs, but now most sites say he's 5'11" 174lbs, so he shrunk a couple inches and only gained 1 pound? Seems like most sites only list players height and weight from when they're drafted. Dach, Gaudette, and Reichel have all said they gained over 10+lbs yet Dach is still listed at 198, Gaudette in the 170s, and Reichel 160s-70s. And I didn't like the Jujhar signing because of the KO you mentioned, plus when he returned he took a light hit and was out again because of a concussion. But he's making under 1mill, so it's not a bad contract. He's strictly a 4th liner, Hawks need a tough top6 forward who can fight and hit, not easy to find or get. |
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Post by T-man2010 on Sept 6, 2021 17:36:41 GMT -6
Hawks sign that Mike Hardman kid out of Boston college.
He looked OK in his 8 games played. 1G and 2A all in the last 4 games.
6-2 and 205lb RW/LW at 22 yrs.
800k per year. 2 year deal.
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Post by OldTimeHawky on Sept 6, 2021 18:33:44 GMT -6
Hawks sign that Mike Hardman kid out of Boston college. He looked OK in his 8 games played. 1G and 2A all in the last 4 games. 6-2 and 205lb RW/LW at 22 yrs. 800k per year. 2 year deal. He can skate and seems good around the net, maybe they'll try him on the top 6, or Entwistle. |
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Post by LordKOTL on Sept 6, 2021 20:32:06 GMT -6
I have high hopes for Hagel, but you're right: guys like Debrincat and Panarin were the ones with the attitude because most of the rest of the lineup seem to play like a bunch of prima donnas. IMHO the problem has to be leveled at the rest of the players, not Debrincat. He needs to keep doing what he's doing (and, IMHO, he should be wearing the A over Murphy all 2022 season). I'm hoping for some better attitude as well, but I'm coming into this year with a more cynical outlook than most. I don't think we have the depth a lot of other fans think we have. I think the 'hawks made improvements but I think the situation will be a lot more like 2016: a few guys step up and carry the team, but they're run into the ground and completely gassed by playoff time and we end up one and done. I hope I'm wrong, but I'm not getting a contender vibe nor am I getting a good vibe that younger players will be allowed to develop and have some growing pains. I can totally see your scenario playing out. Johnson has been on the decline the last couple years. And we’ve already seen what can happen with bringing in an injured free agent. So let’s say Johnson is meh, and McCabe ends up like deHaan. Then what? It’ll be the same all over again. A few years back we had Saad, Crawford and Maatta. Are they that much worse than Johnson, MAF and McCabe? You bring up a lot of valid points. So getting too excited about this team and the regular season in general is not really on the cards for me either!!! The only player I see far-and-away better on paper that you bring up is Crawford vs. MAF. Crawford's numbers are an echelon above Fleury's career numbers and he did it in spite of being behind worse defenses. Thing is...Crawford was a fairly stable netminder, MAF is streaky. We get the excellent MAF he'd be an upgrade over the most recent Crawford except for the 2018 Crawford. If not we've got a starter-average starter, which is an upgrade as yet over Lankienen and Subban. The rest could be washes. Either way IMHO a lot has to go right for the 'hawks to be anything other than one-and-done. I have high hopes for Hagel, but you're right: guys like Debrincat and Panarin were the ones with the attitude because most of the rest of the lineup seem to play like a bunch of prima donnas. IMHO the problem has to be leveled at the rest of the players, not Debrincat. He needs to keep doing what he's doing (and, IMHO, he should be wearing the A over Murphy all 2022 season). I'm hoping for some better attitude as well, but I'm coming into this year with a more cynical outlook than most. I don't think we have the depth a lot of other fans think we have. I think the 'hawks made improvements but I think the situation will be a lot more like 2016: a few guys step up and carry the team, but they're run into the ground and completely gassed by playoff time and we end up one and done. I hope I'm wrong, but I'm not getting a contender vibe nor am I getting a good vibe that younger players will be allowed to develop and have some growing pains. Who on the roster besides Hagel can be that physical,puck retrieving top six winger and why TF do we continue to lean on 170 pounders for this role? How many concussions did small-framed guys like Shaw and Caggulia suffer tying the role for us? To be honest,Bret 'buyout' Connolly SHOULD be the guy for this role with his experience and size @3.5M but I almost never see him penciled into anyone's lineup,the speed of the game may have passed him by. I like the 'A' on D-Cat too,28 as a rook,41 with Strome and Perlini,18 on a checking line(LOFL) and a 50 goal pace last year skating with dubious linemates. What on earth would this kid look like skating with a good center and a real power forward on his off side? Jones is an upgrade on a 38yro Keith,MAF is an upgrade on Lankinen and JT is a massive upgrade on what we referred to as centers last year so the team SHOULD be better than last year's 1 under record......it's yet to be proven how much better. I like the idea of a bigger,tougher D-man like McCabe but I don't like the idea of his entire knee being put back together last year......I sincerely wish him good health because we need his type DESPERATELY. We wouldn't be in need of this type if the nitwit pursued Chiarot two years ago instead of Maata and deHAAN-job......Habs signed a healthy Chiarot for 3.5M as an URA and a 'tough as hell' Chiarot helped them to a SCF berth and we retained $$$ to make Maata go away......brilliant. Yes, I think the team should be better, but I don't think it's *that* much better...like I said I think this team is one-and-done. And yeah, I agree that Stan seems to have been throwing darts in terms of getting vet d-men either by signing or trading. I'm okay with Murph but he's equal to a worn-down Hjammer (he's nowhere near a prime Hjammer). Maata was bad. DeHaan was bad. Zadorov was not that good, either. Maybe McCabe will be better but who knows? Even if McCabe is good unless one of the other D-men steps up he, Murph, and Jones will be seeing a fuckton of icetime, and thus they'll likely be gassed come later in the year if someone else doesn't step up. Just like before with deHaan, McCabe is damaged goods. Does MAF get run the fuck over here? Like Crow did? I still see a lot of similarities, and Toews has said that he may not be ready for the start of the season. Does this coach force players like Nylander (or is forced) on top players and bring down a line? If McCabe is a bust, and it’s possible coming off those surgeries, it’s not like he was a game changer before hand. That seriously cripples the depth. And we’re stuck with pretty much what we had before, and for 4 years. So I see very cautious optimism here!!! I'd rather have McCabe over de Haan, to bad they couldn't move Calvin this off season. But if McCabe gets injured it wouldn't seriously cripple the depth, that sounds pretty drastic. It'll mean whoever's sitting will play and there'll be good players not playing, Mitchell, Beaudin, Regula, etc. Caleb, if he's not on the opening night roster, and maybe Krutil, Phillips, Krys or another kid makes big strides from last season. There's depth. It was sad how Crow got ran over by Malkin and Seabs did nothing, or when E. Kane shoved Strome into Crow after the whistle and nothing was done about it, but there's no way Gus or Keith would confront Kane. I hope with a big true #1 like Seth it won't happen again, Stan and JC both said they want this team to play tougher, we'll see. As for Nylander, after he signed his 1yr show me deal he said watching the games last season he learned a lot and he wants to be good defensively and become consistent offensively, once again, we'll see. But I doubt he'll be in the lineup if he doesn't deserve to be there. It's not the depth the 'hawks need to be successful in my opinion. We got Jones, McCabe (if healthy) and Murph. Who else there is proven to soak up minutes without shooting the team in the foot? That's one of the things that has to go right: One of the youngsters needs to step up. Right now I see no one of the roster outside of Jones/McCabe/Murph who is close to what even Oduya was for us...or even what what Sopel was for us. That's a problem. The team D once again will need to lean heavily on the netminding to get things done or a butt-tonne of scoring. MAF is good, but his numbers when playing behind bad defenses are not as good as Crawford's were...and that should be worrisome. As for Crawford being ran by Malkin, I was more upset that Keith didn't do anything. Yeah, Seabrook was old and slow and should have stepped up too, but Keith was as useless as fake tits on a zombie back in 2017/2018. Keith could have done the right thing, pretended Malkin was Coyle and swashbucked his ass for that. He could have leaned into the strikezone, took one for the team, and then could have been back to being a great defenseman for the 'hawks like he was in 2019. |
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Post by hsbob on Sept 7, 2021 6:29:27 GMT -6
No bigger Hagel guy than me all summer,I called for his re-do when some others said he should go if he won't sign cheap but here we are again looking to a 174lb F'ing kid to settle the team's hash. Hagle also took a bad,late hit from Goodrow when the bigger Murphy refused to answer but hey.....he's a tough Lil Dude like Shaw and Caggulia and who else will protect him? Khaira is a big guy who will fight but he's also a 27yro player with 24 career goals,in other words,another big,tough guy who isn't very talented and was added as an afterthought. We can always add size later I've been told for years' and that's exactly what happened with him. Will he even draw in most of the time with the number of forwards on the roster and will he be as physical as he's been in the past when he does? He also took a nasty KO from Ritchie last time he 'went' and needed help off the ice due to it,he might be happy if he isn't asked to do that here after his last tilt. I might be a bigger fan but it's not a competition lol I started a Hagel thread after he signed his intial contract in 2018 and updated his stats after every game. Watching the highlights during his last season in Red Deer I became a huge fan, especially with Brent Sutter talking so highly of him. But it's funny how Red Deer had him listed at 6'1" 173lbs, but now most sites say he's 5'11" 174lbs, so he shrunk a couple inches and only gained 1 pound? Seems like most sites only list players height and weight from when they're drafted. Dach, Gaudette, and Reichel have all said they gained over 10+lbs yet Dach is still listed at 198, Gaudette in the 170s, and Reichel 160s-70s. And I didn't like the Jujhar signing because of the KO you mentioned, plus when he returned he took a light hit and was out again because of a concussion. But he's making under 1mill, so it's not a bad contract. He's strictly a 4th liner, Hawks need a tough top6 forward who can fight and hit, not easy to find or get. I recall you toutin' him before he got here OTH and you were right on,his effort was well known but his skill level offensively seems to be big league level too and he scored at every level so far. It seems the Hawks site never updates young players weight,Beaudin turns 22 in a month.......I highly doubt he's still 168lbs he's been shown as since he was drafted. I dunno if it's just the Hawks but I do remember them showing weight increases for players like Keith and others in the past. Same for Mitchell @173lbs,both are 5'11" and 168-173lbs is dam skinny @5'11". Would it be that frickin hard to update players weight or height,I'm sure they're measured at the start of camp. I still believe it's hard for some 21yros who played in the 170's for a long time to gain that 10-15lbs without losing a little speed or quickness,I recall Cagguila saying he went from 180 to 170 trying to keep up with the speed in the league. |
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Post by hsbob on Sept 7, 2021 6:35:29 GMT -6
Hawks sign that Mike Hardman kid out of Boston college. He looked OK in his 8 games played. 1G and 2A all in the last 4 games. 6-2 and 205lb RW/LW at 22 yrs. 800k per year. 2 year deal. He can skate and seems good around the net, maybe they'll try him on the top 6, or Entwistle. I liked what I saw too,taking a piece of a guy looked like it was second nature to him but then again,he didn't come up in our system. |
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Post by hsbob on Sept 7, 2021 6:47:29 GMT -6
I can totally see your scenario playing out. Johnson has been on the decline the last couple years. And we’ve already seen what can happen with bringing in an injured free agent. So let’s say Johnson is meh, and McCabe ends up like deHaan. Then what? It’ll be the same all over again. A few years back we had Saad, Crawford and Maatta. Are they that much worse than Johnson, MAF and McCabe? You bring up a lot of valid points. So getting too excited about this team and the regular season in general is not really on the cards for me either!!! The only player I see far-and-away better on paper that you bring up is Crawford vs. MAF. Crawford's numbers are an echelon above Fleury's career numbers and he did it in spite of being behind worse defenses. Thing is...Crawford was a fairly stable netminder, MAF is streaky. We get the excellent MAF he'd be an upgrade over the most recent Crawford except for the 2018 Crawford. If not we've got a starter-average starter, which is an upgrade as yet over Lankienen and Subban. The rest could be washes. Either way IMHO a lot has to go right for the 'hawks to be anything other than one-and-done. Who on the roster besides Hagel can be that physical,puck retrieving top six winger and why TF do we continue to lean on 170 pounders for this role? How many concussions did small-framed guys like Shaw and Caggulia suffer tying the role for us? To be honest,Bret 'buyout' Connolly SHOULD be the guy for this role with his experience and size @3.5M but I almost never see him penciled into anyone's lineup,the speed of the game may have passed him by. I like the 'A' on D-Cat too,28 as a rook,41 with Strome and Perlini,18 on a checking line(LOFL) and a 50 goal pace last year skating with dubious linemates. What on earth would this kid look like skating with a good center and a real power forward on his off side? Jones is an upgrade on a 38yro Keith,MAF is an upgrade on Lankinen and JT is a massive upgrade on what we referred to as centers last year so the team SHOULD be better than last year's 1 under record......it's yet to be proven how much better. I like the idea of a bigger,tougher D-man like McCabe but I don't like the idea of his entire knee being put back together last year......I sincerely wish him good health because we need his type DESPERATELY. We wouldn't be in need of this type if the nitwit pursued Chiarot two years ago instead of Maata and deHAAN-job......Habs signed a healthy Chiarot for 3.5M as an URA and a 'tough as hell' Chiarot helped them to a SCF berth and we retained $$$ to make Maata go away......brilliant. Yes, I think the team should be better, but I don't think it's *that* much better...like I said I think this team is one-and-done. And yeah, I agree that Stan seems to have been throwing darts in terms of getting vet d-men either by signing or trading. I'm okay with Murph but he's equal to a worn-down Hjammer (he's nowhere near a prime Hjammer). Maata was bad. DeHaan was bad. Zadorov was not that good, either. Maybe McCabe will be better but who knows? Even if McCabe is good unless one of the other D-men steps up he, Murph, and Jones will be seeing a fuckton of icetime, and thus they'll likely be gassed come later in the year if someone else doesn't step up. I'd rather have McCabe over de Haan, to bad they couldn't move Calvin this off season. But if McCabe gets injured it wouldn't seriously cripple the depth, that sounds pretty drastic. It'll mean whoever's sitting will play and there'll be good players not playing, Mitchell, Beaudin, Regula, etc. Caleb, if he's not on the opening night roster, and maybe Krutil, Phillips, Krys or another kid makes big strides from last season. There's depth. It was sad how Crow got ran over by Malkin and Seabs did nothing, or when E. Kane shoved Strome into Crow after the whistle and nothing was done about it, but there's no way Gus or Keith would confront Kane. I hope with a big true #1 like Seth it won't happen again, Stan and JC both said they want this team to play tougher, we'll see. As for Nylander, after he signed his 1yr show me deal he said watching the games last season he learned a lot and he wants to be good defensively and become consistent offensively, once again, we'll see. But I doubt he'll be in the lineup if he doesn't deserve to be there. It's not the depth the 'hawks need to be successful in my opinion. We got Jones, McCabe (if healthy) and Murph. Who else there is proven to soak up minutes without shooting the team in the foot? That's one of the things that has to go right: One of the youngsters needs to step up. Right now I see no one of the roster outside of Jones/McCabe/Murph who is close to what even Oduya was for us...or even what what Sopel was for us. That's a problem. The team D once again will need to lean heavily on the netminding to get things done or a butt-tonne of scoring. MAF is good, but his numbers when playing behind bad defenses are not as good as Crawford's were...and that should be worrisome. As for Crawford being ran by Malkin, I was more upset that Keith didn't do anything. Yeah, Seabrook was old and slow and should have stepped up too, but Keith was as useless as fake tits on a zombie back in 2017/2018. Keith could have done the right thing, pretended Malkin was Coyle and swashbucked his ass for that. He could have leaned into the strikezone, took one for the team, and then could have been back to being a great defenseman for the 'hawks like he was in 2019. I'll admit it seemed Keith only got really pissed off when somebody F'ed with him but I now see Keith and Seabs being blamed for the pussification of the team and I disagree. Go back and watch the battles with Vancouver and a few other teams and we see both D-men engaging physically. Both got tired of having to eat the minutes and provide the toughness too and Seabs had a few instances where he was OUT on his feet after the Wiz and POS Torres hits,they shoulda had a tougher D-man or two join the group as they aged but all they got were pussies so they stopped engaging......don't blame em one bit! Maybe Keith felt he was too important to the team to fight like the bigger,younger Murphy felt. |
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Post by LordKOTL on Sept 7, 2021 10:52:44 GMT -6
The only player I see far-and-away better on paper that you bring up is Crawford vs. MAF. Crawford's numbers are an echelon above Fleury's career numbers and he did it in spite of being behind worse defenses. Thing is...Crawford was a fairly stable netminder, MAF is streaky. We get the excellent MAF he'd be an upgrade over the most recent Crawford except for the 2018 Crawford. If not we've got a starter-average starter, which is an upgrade as yet over Lankienen and Subban. The rest could be washes. Either way IMHO a lot has to go right for the 'hawks to be anything other than one-and-done. Yes, I think the team should be better, but I don't think it's *that* much better...like I said I think this team is one-and-done. And yeah, I agree that Stan seems to have been throwing darts in terms of getting vet d-men either by signing or trading. I'm okay with Murph but he's equal to a worn-down Hjammer (he's nowhere near a prime Hjammer). Maata was bad. DeHaan was bad. Zadorov was not that good, either. Maybe McCabe will be better but who knows? Even if McCabe is good unless one of the other D-men steps up he, Murph, and Jones will be seeing a fuckton of icetime, and thus they'll likely be gassed come later in the year if someone else doesn't step up. It's not the depth the 'hawks need to be successful in my opinion. We got Jones, McCabe (if healthy) and Murph. Who else there is proven to soak up minutes without shooting the team in the foot? That's one of the things that has to go right: One of the youngsters needs to step up. Right now I see no one of the roster outside of Jones/McCabe/Murph who is close to what even Oduya was for us...or even what what Sopel was for us. That's a problem. The team D once again will need to lean heavily on the netminding to get things done or a butt-tonne of scoring. MAF is good, but his numbers when playing behind bad defenses are not as good as Crawford's were...and that should be worrisome. As for Crawford being ran by Malkin, I was more upset that Keith didn't do anything. Yeah, Seabrook was old and slow and should have stepped up too, but Keith was as useless as fake tits on a zombie back in 2017/2018. Keith could have done the right thing, pretended Malkin was Coyle and swashbucked his ass for that. He could have leaned into the strikezone, took one for the team, and then could have been back to being a great defenseman for the 'hawks like he was in 2019. I'll admit it seemed Keith only got really pissed off when somebody F'ed with him but I now see Keith and Seabs being blamed for the pussification of the team and I disagree. Go back and watch the battles with Vancouver and a few other teams and we see both D-men engaging physically. Both got tired of having to eat the minutes and provide the toughness too and Seabs had a few instances where he was OUT on his feet after the Wiz and POS Torres hits,they shoulda had a tougher D-man or two join the group as they aged but all they got were pussies so they stopped engaging......don't blame em one bit! Maybe Keith felt he was too important to the team to fight like the bigger,younger Murphy felt. I'm not blaming Keith (or Seabrook) for the pussification of the team--I think that's someone in the upper brass that's doing it. That being said though I do think sometimes your letter-wearers need to step up when no one else will. Toews did in the past--even when he shouldn't have been. My point was Keith was doing absolutely nothing good in 2017-2018. Him going Basil Rathbone on Malkin wouldn't have hurt the team. Maybe I'm completely nuts here but if you're a player who's on a cold streak, sometimes you gotta be the one to lean into the strike zone. Now, to be fair and to your point, I don't think Keith should have engaged when Kane ran Crawford because Keith was playing like our best defenseman. Seabrook? Maybe he could have. The whole point is that no one took either of those teams to task. No one ran Jones or Murray. No one went after a smaller player. I think that lack of pack mentality from *all* the on-ice players is disturbing. Something had to be driving it and if we find out what that is we need to terminate it with extreme prejudice. P.S. Murphy's comments are reason enough for Debrincat to wear the A full time in my opinion. |
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Post by OldTimeHawky on Sept 7, 2021 21:07:51 GMT -6
Should the Hawks trade Strome now or wait to see if Toews starts the season?
That's a tough one cause Strome's still young, big, and has sweet hands. But he's not comfortable on the wing and shouldn't be on the bottom 6.
I couldn't find an old post but someone suggested trading him to Montreal for Guhle, of course there'd be more pieces but those are the main guys.
When the Habs drafted Guhle ahead of Reichel Montreal told Chicago they were drafting a forward so they didn't offer a trade to move up one. Habs lied and took the dman Chicago wanted. That'll be nice having him in the D pool. Big lefty with Toews like leadership, at the draft someone mentioned he's like captain serious and how he is about the game and work ethic.
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Post by galaxytrash on Sept 7, 2021 21:40:00 GMT -6
No bigger Hagel guy than me all summer,I called for his re-do when some others said he should go if he won't sign cheap but here we are again looking to a 174lb F'ing kid to settle the team's hash. Hagle also took a bad,late hit from Goodrow when the bigger Murphy refused to answer but hey.....he's a tough Lil Dude like Shaw and Caggulia and who else will protect him? Khaira is a big guy who will fight but he's also a 27yro player with 24 career goals,in other words,another big,tough guy who isn't very talented and was added as an afterthought. We can always add size later I've been told for years' and that's exactly what happened with him. Will he even draw in most of the time with the number of forwards on the roster and will he be as physical as he's been in the past when he does? He also took a nasty KO from Ritchie last time he 'went' and needed help off the ice due to it,he might be happy if he isn't asked to do that here after his last tilt. I started a Hagel thread after he signed his intial contract in 2018 and updated his stats after every game. Watching the highlights during his last season in Red Deer I became a huge fan, especially with Brent Sutter talking so highly of him. i was poking around trying to find a more recent weight/height on hagel, no such luck. the majority are like you say....5'11" and 174 lbs. something i saw which i never realized before that in his last year in red deer, he led the team in scoring (41g, 61a 102 pts.) the thing that i found unusual was that the 2nd place scorer finished a whopping 49 points behind him. (reese johnson, 27g, 26a, 53 pts.) he finished 4th in the WHL that year in scoring which surprised me a bit too because the rebels weren't that great of a club that year and the numbers say that hagel was mostly responsible for his own success. so even though he was an undersized 20 year old when buffalo drafted him, it seemed like he's still pretty good value for a 6th round pick. anyways, i'm glad we got him and i'm glad he signed with us. |
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Post by OldTimeHawky on Sept 7, 2021 22:00:28 GMT -6
I started a Hagel thread after he signed his intial contract in 2018 and updated his stats after every game. Watching the highlights during his last season in Red Deer I became a huge fan, especially with Brent Sutter talking so highly of him. i was poking around trying to find a more recent weight/height on hagel, no such luck. the majority are like you say....5'11" and 174 lbs. something i saw which i never realized before that in his last year in red deer, he led the team in scoring (41g, 61a 102 pts.) the thing that i found unusual was that the 2nd place scorer finished a whopping 49 points behind him. (reese johnson, 27g, 26a, 53 pts.) he finished 4th in the WHL that year in scoring which surprised me a bit too because the rebels weren't that great of a club that year and the numbers say that hagel was mostly responsible for his own success. so even though he was an undersized 20 year old when buffalo drafted him, it seemed like he's still pretty good value for a 6th round pick. anyways, i'm glad we got him and i'm glad he signed with us. I like to think he's 6' lol looks better. And his body type can't build mass but you can tell he's strong, like Kubalik who's 6'2" or 3" and in the 180s. But he must've gained 6lbs since his draft year. His last year in Red Deer is when I started the Hagel page on the old boards. I had a link to the Rebels site on my phone so I watched the highlights and interviews afterwards and just like every game last season you couldn't help but recognize him. His solo efforts to score or finding his teammates was fun to watch. Last season his first TEN GAMES he had no goals and I think 1 assist, but from game 1 he was talked about and got breakaways because of his speed and hard work. Now he knows what he has to work on, should be a fun season to watch him. Buffalo let him walk 😂 As for Johnson, 5 hits in his first NHL game and played hard but composed, he's like a bigger Shaw. He'll be fighting for a spot in training camp, literally. He was Hagels center for a couple seasons and they're best friends, move Carpenter to give this kid a shot. |
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Post by OldTimeHawky on Sept 7, 2021 22:17:42 GMT -6
A player that plays tough hockey that could get a look on the top 6 if needed is the Notre Dame kid, Cam Morrison. Made the taxi squad 2 seasons ago but tore his mcl during a Hogs preseason game, was out 5-6mnths and never played.
He would've been one of the first call ups last season. Big smart 2way forward.
Slavin is another bigger player that might surprise people at camp.
Of course there's Hardman and Entwistle.
I'm sure all of the guys I mentioned, and Reese Johnson, would drop the gloves when needed, especially if someone takes liberties with Kane, Debrincat, Toews, or Dach.
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Post by Tater on Sept 7, 2021 22:26:46 GMT -6
As for Johnson, 5 hits in his first NHL game and played hard but composed, he's like a bigger Shaw. He'll be fighting for a spot in training camp, literally. He was Hagels center for a couple seasons and they're best friends, move Carpenter to give this kid a shot.
I would love to see this happen. I hope they at least give the pairing a solid look in training camp and pre-season. |
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Post by LordKOTL on Sept 8, 2021 8:18:01 GMT -6
I started a Hagel thread after he signed his intial contract in 2018 and updated his stats after every game. Watching the highlights during his last season in Red Deer I became a huge fan, especially with Brent Sutter talking so highly of him. i was poking around trying to find a more recent weight/height on hagel, no such luck. the majority are like you say....5'11" and 174 lbs. something i saw which i never realized before that in his last year in red deer, he led the team in scoring (41g, 61a 102 pts.) the thing that i found unusual was that the 2nd place scorer finished a whopping 49 points behind him. (reese johnson, 27g, 26a, 53 pts.) he finished 4th in the WHL that year in scoring which surprised me a bit too because the rebels weren't that great of a club that year and the numbers say that hagel was mostly responsible for his own success. so even though he was an undersized 20 year old when buffalo drafted him, it seemed like he's still pretty good value for a 6th round pick. anyways, i'm glad we got him and i'm glad he signed with us. Agreed. Truth be told I'd rather have a munchkin who plays like a rabid wolverine than a juggernaut who plays like a cupcake. It's why I love guys like Hagel, Shaw, and Debrincat; they all play larger than they actually are (or were) |
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Post by hsbob on Sept 8, 2021 9:13:53 GMT -6
I started a Hagel thread after he signed his intial contract in 2018 and updated his stats after every game. Watching the highlights during his last season in Red Deer I became a huge fan, especially with Brent Sutter talking so highly of him. i was poking around trying to find a more recent weight/height on hagel, no such luck. the majority are like you say....5'11" and 174 lbs. something i saw which i never realized before that in his last year in red deer, he led the team in scoring (41g, 61a 102 pts.) the thing that i found unusual was that the 2nd place scorer finished a whopping 49 points behind him. (reese johnson, 27g, 26a, 53 pts.) he finished 4th in the WHL that year in scoring which surprised me a bit too because the rebels weren't that great of a club that year and the numbers say that hagel was mostly responsible for his own success. so even though he was an undersized 20 year old when buffalo drafted him, it seemed like he's still pretty good value for a 6th round pick. anyways, i'm glad we got him and i'm glad he signed with us. I called the kid a must re-do back in early July,got a little push back too but he's scored at every level so far. I just thought his 'take no shift off' style was what fans wanted when they called for a 'full sixty minute effort' from the team. His style should rub off on young players and veterans alike IMO,let's hope the staff sees him as more than a bottom six grinder because he is more. |
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Post by hsbob on Sept 8, 2021 9:21:29 GMT -6
i was poking around trying to find a more recent weight/height on hagel, no such luck. the majority are like you say....5'11" and 174 lbs. something i saw which i never realized before that in his last year in red deer, he led the team in scoring (41g, 61a 102 pts.) the thing that i found unusual was that the 2nd place scorer finished a whopping 49 points behind him. (reese johnson, 27g, 26a, 53 pts.) he finished 4th in the WHL that year in scoring which surprised me a bit too because the rebels weren't that great of a club that year and the numbers say that hagel was mostly responsible for his own success. so even though he was an undersized 20 year old when buffalo drafted him, it seemed like he's still pretty good value for a 6th round pick. anyways, i'm glad we got him and i'm glad he signed with us. Agreed. Truth be told I'd rather have a munchkin who plays like a rabid wolverine than a juggernaut who plays like a cupcake. It's why I love guys like Hagel, Shaw, and Debrincat; they all play larger than they actually are (or were) NO DOUBT! Let's just hope Hagel shows the durability of D-Cat and not the durability of Shaw or Caggiula(two other small-framed guys who played like rabid wolverines),Hagel has shown durability so far though and I gotta think he's more around mid 180's now than what he's listed at. I'd be great to have that 6'2" 200lb plus power forward but I been sayin' that for years......as it is,I'd like to see Hagel get a real shot at top six minutes this year. |
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Post by LordKOTL on Sept 8, 2021 9:42:11 GMT -6
Agreed. Truth be told I'd rather have a munchkin who plays like a rabid wolverine than a juggernaut who plays like a cupcake. It's why I love guys like Hagel, Shaw, and Debrincat; they all play larger than they actually are (or were) NO DOUBT! Let's just hope Hagel shows the durability of D-Cat and not the durability of Shaw or Caggiula(two other small-framed guys who played like rabid wolverines),Hagel has shown durability so far though and I gotta think he's more around mid 180's now than what he's listed at. I'd be great to have that 6'2" 200lb plus power forward but I been sayin' that for years......as it is,I'd like to see Hagel get a real shot at top six minutes this year. I'd love a bigger power forward too, but one that has heart. Still, the one thing about guys like Hagelstorm and El Gato is that hopefully their rabid tenacity and heart is contagious for some of the other guys. |
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Post by irmaks on Sept 8, 2021 11:50:08 GMT -6
i was poking around trying to find a more recent weight/height on hagel, no such luck. the majority are like you say....5'11" and 174 lbs. something i saw which i never realized before that in his last year in red deer, he led the team in scoring (41g, 61a 102 pts.) the thing that i found unusual was that the 2nd place scorer finished a whopping 49 points behind him. (reese johnson, 27g, 26a, 53 pts.) he finished 4th in the WHL that year in scoring which surprised me a bit too because the rebels weren't that great of a club that year and the numbers say that hagel was mostly responsible for his own success. so even though he was an undersized 20 year old when buffalo drafted him, it seemed like he's still pretty good value for a 6th round pick. anyways, i'm glad we got him and i'm glad he signed with us. I like to think he's 6' lol looks better. And his body type can't build mass but you can tell he's strong, like Kubalik who's 6'2" or 3" and in the 180s. But he must've gained 6lbs since his draft year. His last year in Red Deer is when I started the Hagel page on the old boards. I had a link to the Rebels site on my phone so I watched the highlights and interviews afterwards and just like every game last season you couldn't help but recognize him. His solo efforts to score or finding his teammates was fun to watch. Last season his first TEN GAMES he had no goals and I think 1 assist, but from game 1 he was talked about and got breakaways because of his speed and hard work. Now he knows what he has to work on, should be a fun season to watch him. Buffalo let him walk 😂 As for Johnson, 5 hits in his first NHL game and played hard but composed, he's like a bigger Shaw. He'll be fighting for a spot in training camp, literally. He was Hagels center for a couple seasons and they're best friends, move Carpenter to give this kid a shot. And on top of it they are cousins 🙂 |
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