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Post by mvr on Apr 17, 2024 5:30:32 GMT -6
No doubt about it- Kotkaniemi is having a down year. Montreal drafted the player too high. He likely will never be more than a two way third-line centre.
But so what?
It is extremely challenging for teams to find centres with size who can play a defensive game. There are presently zero promising big centres in the system. They take years to develop and typically do not fully emerge until their late twenties.
Even still, Kotkaniemi likely tops out as a Dickinson-type player. Dickinson will be making just about the same as Kotkaniemi next year. To my mind, the Dickinson contract is money well spent.
Carolina needs cap space. They will be making some room this summer. My guess is that the Kotkaniemi contract will be difficult to trade. My guess is that it will trade a large bribe to find a taker. Davidson will need to actually negotiate to get a fair return, something he has not done well to this point.
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Post by ebonyraptor on Apr 17, 2024 6:18:15 GMT -6
No doubt about it- Kotkaniemi is having a down year. Montreal drafted the player too high. He likely will never be more than a two way third-line centre. But so what? It is extremely challenging for teams to find centres with size who can play a defensive game. There are presently zero promising big centres in the system. They take years to develop and typically do not fully emerge until their late twenties. Even still, Kotkaniemi likely tops out as a Dickinson-type player. Dickinson will be making just about the same as Kotkaniemi next year. To my mind, the Dickinson contract is money well spent. Carolina needs cap space. They will be making some room this summer. My guess is that the Kotkaniemi contract will be difficult to trade. My guess is that it will trade a large bribe to find a taker. Davidson will need to actually negotiate to get a fair return, something he has not done well to this point. Yeah well, that's just like your opinion man.  |
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Post by mvr on Apr 17, 2024 6:36:00 GMT -6
As is everything here.
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Post by BigT on Apr 17, 2024 7:50:19 GMT -6
No doubt about it- Kotkaniemi is having a down year. Montreal drafted the player too high. He likely will never be more than a two way third-line centre. But so what? It is extremely challenging for teams to find centres with size who can play a defensive game. There are presently zero promising big centres in the system. They take years to develop and typically do not fully emerge until their late twenties. Even still, Kotkaniemi likely tops out as a Dickinson-type player. Dickinson will be making just about the same as Kotkaniemi next year. To my mind, the Dickinson contract is money well spent. Carolina needs cap space. They will be making some room this summer. My guess is that the Kotkaniemi contract will be difficult to trade. My guess is that it will trade a large bribe to find a taker. Davidson will need to actually negotiate to get a fair return, something he has not done well to this point. My worry about your assessment is that you’re assuming a lot here. You’re assuming that Kotkaniemi wants to be a 3rd line defensive center. And that he’ll accept that role. There’s reasons why players become healthy scratches. They refuse a role. Now, that hasn’t happened in Carolina. But he may very well not accept that in Chicago. He’s got 12 goals 15 assists for 27 points. And is a -4 on a great team. They had him at 2nd center until they got Kuznetzov. I’m not sold on him. He’s 23 and I’d have to think the Canes won’t sell him off for nothing. It’ll take picks and or prospects to get him. So it’s best to cross him off a list unless you’re willing to pay for him!!! |
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Post by hsbob on Apr 17, 2024 9:35:02 GMT -6
Before anyone screams "cap space," let's remember: the Hawks are more than $15 M below the cap this year. Zaitsev and Tyler Johnson are off the books this summer saving another $10 M. There is at least another $5 M in gained cap space as buyouts mature for Duncan Keith and several others. No question there is room moving forward for all three of Skinner, Kotkaniemi and Pinto (with plenty to spare both in the short term and beyond). If KD can acquire Skinner - count me in. The other two - not so much. First, I'm not high on Kotkaniemi, especially at his extended cap hit of $4.8M. I think he maxes out at around a 50pt player which isn't bad but I hope one or more of the prospects coming up the ranks can provide that or more. Second, Pinto will probably not become available because with Josh Norris' injury history Ottawa will be counting on Pinto being their 2C behind Stutzle. I think KD assumes Hall comes back able to play all or most of next season. Acquire Skinner and Hall-Bedard-Skinner provides Bedard with top-6 level talent to play with. Move Kurashev down to play with Reichel and Nazar and there's the 2nd line. The veterans available to fill out the lineup would be guys under contract for next season - Foligno, Dickenson, Athanasiou, Donato, and maybe re-sign Anderson and/or Blackwell and then complete the lineup with Slaggert and another prospect or two. In summary - I think we need a Skinner type top-6 winger for Bedard and we need Hall to come back and play. Everything else we've already got in-house or can re-sign. I get the short-term aspect of Skinner who turned 31 yesterday and what's 27M worth of play-money gonna hurt. Maybe his nearly 50% drop-off in offensive production has to do with the frustration of his Org's mismanagement and the HC carousel. How'd the acquisition of 31yro Hall go for 6MX2 though? I know he got hurt,old players with a lotta miles get hurt. Skinner has been able to stay healthy and could have a bounce-back season or two and the team can EASILY absorb that contract,but make no mistake,that contract would set a bit of a precedent. Where does Bedard's camp start after watching Skinner collect 9M for a few years? Kotka's 23 years old for cryin' out loud,he consistantly wins over half his draws and was put in a more defensive role this year because he's a good defender and he kills penalties too. His offensive number regressed but so did his TOI and PP time,he hasn't flourished offensively in Rod's defense-first system but he has learned to play defense. You don't think this kid's best hockey is still in front of him @23? The term could be problematic,but his age allows the term IMO and 4.8M could just as easily be a steal as it could a problem. Big,young centers who've already proven they can win draws and play D at the NHL level will have a certain value and I don't see that big,raw-boned center who have these qualities in the 'ranks'. Ottawa has a problem on their hands with Josh Norris,he's a very talented center when healthy but he can't stay healthy. The issue with him is,he'll once again re-join the team not long after next season begins,which will keep Ott from being able to LTIR his money and he'll be coming-off his 3rd serious shoulder injury in two years this summer,which will mean moving him is very problematic. The Sens can list Giroux as a RW but he's been a center his entire career,he averaged 20mins this year and won 58% of his FO's and he takes a lotta FO's......RW or no RW. Ditto for Big Brady,he saw 19mins plus and won 53% of his draws.....he also takes a lotta them. Ridly Greig also had a nice rookie debut at center and the 21yro was a +10 on a -26 team,20yro 6'4" 203lb Ostapchuk also saw 7gms at center at the end of the year. They pretty much have to hang in there with Norris at this point and hope the talented 24yro center can stay healthy,which leaves little space for Pinto and they have the other young centers ready I mentioned. I believe Shane Pinto will be available this summer and I also believe he's gonna be a stud. Adding quality players in their early 20's who already have some serious experience could give the team players who could grow and further develop alongside Bedard,Nazar and the other kids to come. Hoping a few grossly over-paid,old guys who won't be here in a year or three have resurgences is a riskier endeavor than pursuing younger players IMO,but more picks.....more picks! |
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Post by mvr on Apr 17, 2024 12:27:05 GMT -6
No doubt about it- Kotkaniemi is having a down year. Montreal drafted the player too high. He likely will never be more than a two way third-line centre. But so what? It is extremely challenging for teams to find centres with size who can play a defensive game. There are presently zero promising big centres in the system. They take years to develop and typically do not fully emerge until their late twenties. Even still, Kotkaniemi likely tops out as a Dickinson-type player. Dickinson will be making just about the same as Kotkaniemi next year. To my mind, the Dickinson contract is money well spent. Carolina needs cap space. They will be making some room this summer. My guess is that the Kotkaniemi contract will be difficult to trade. My guess is that it will trade a large bribe to find a taker. Davidson will need to actually negotiate to get a fair return, something he has not done well to this point. My worry about your assessment is that you’re assuming a lot here. You’re assuming that Kotkaniemi wants to be a 3rd line defensive center. And that he’ll accept that role. There’s reasons why players become healthy scratches. They refuse a role. Now, that hasn’t happened in Carolina. But he may very well not accept that in Chicago. He’s got 12 goals 15 assists for 27 points. And is a -4 on a great team. They had him at 2nd center until they got Kuznetzov. I’m not sold on him. He’s 23 and I’d have to think the Canes won’t sell him off for nothing. It’ll take picks and or prospects to get him. So it’s best to cross him off a list unless you’re willing to pay for him!!! Agreeing to take on another team's cap problem should cost the seller not the buyer. If Carolina does not play ball with a fair compensation package (think the Teuvo Teravainen/Bickell deal with Bowman then add some more), then the best idea is to move on. There are other teams in a similar cap bind. The Hawks have $35 M in cap space. They should spend at least $12-15 M on two big young centres for the second and third lines. If they do, everything else falls into place. |
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Post by vadarx on Apr 17, 2024 13:17:01 GMT -6
clearly you're not a golfer. (i agree, you are correct on everything being an opinion here, I'm just following along with the Big Lebowski quotes here 😁) |
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Post by LordKOTL on Apr 17, 2024 13:39:28 GMT -6
Too go of of ER, was the previous build perfect? We're there moves that are regrettable that could have gotten us another cup? Probably. But we still got 3 cups. In the same vein, how many of the 2006 roster got the 2010 cup? 2013? 2015? We need lukewarm bodies to fill out the roster and they will be turned over. We got some guys on the roster with potential long term. Everyone else should be shuffled out The previous build was as perfect as a build's gonna get IMO,it's a high bar to measure-up to and nearly unparalleled in the cap era. I won't say every move was perfect but I recall few if any "regrettable" moves myself. The cap gutted the 11&12 teams and my only regret was the puck bouncing-in off Ledy in OT of the 2014 WCF game seven. If this rebuild was at the very begining,more shuffling out of warm bodies would be required but I don't see it at the very beginning. There's still a good number of prospects from the previous regime and the team's already drafted five times in the 1st,five times in the 2nd and five times in the 3rd just in the past two years with even more surpluses in the bank the next 2-3 drafts. Some prospects will undoubtedly be moved out,but if all seven picks in the first 3 rounds are retained this summer,it'll give the team aprox thirty in-system kids from rounds 1-3 alone to go along with later round picks......the team will have amassed SEVEN 1st round picks in three consecutive drafts. I think these numbers suggest the rebuild should be well on it's path and the presence of Bedard,the immergence of Vlasic and KK to a lesser extent and Kurashev's encouraging play should have some impact on the trajectory too. Continuing to shuffle warm bodies in and out could have a less than ideal effect on these good,young players if it goes on for too long. The kids will need a few years to develop and some time to get their legs under them once they're up with the big club,but what kind of atmosphere do we want these kids to develop in? No one's advocating for the late 20's max-term,max-money UFA,but the team will have it's draft foundation in place after this summer,targeting an age appropriate,talented forward or two who'll be in their mid 20's in a few years helps the kids that are here in the meantime and offers better support for the kids to come. I don't expect much over the next two seasons but a competitive atmosphere would be advantageous and Jr's gonna have to shit or get off the pot at some point. I seem to recall that after 2010, there were some missteps in the offseason where Stan mishandled a couple of signings leaving the team wanting in 2011 and 2012, which was promptly and resoundingly fixed in 2013. All's well that ends well of course, don't get me wrong. I look at this build as from the beginning for now because we don't know how many of the previous gen guys will play out--Bowman was trying to build an entirely different team; one based around Dach and Jones. KD isn't. There's a chance they contribute to the current build, or they're just stops along the way like the ABC line or Ruutu--but we're only seeing what the ABC line or Ruutu are with no foreknowledge past the spring of 2006. Unfortunately, neither the trade market nor the FA market will have every long-term piece we need right now for the right price. The pieces we can get via trade, FA, and draft/develop hopefully will come as soon as possible, but until they do we'll have to round out the roster. For those players, it should not be long term; the deals should be movable. But, that being said this year has shown us a lot as to where everyone is and what holes the lineup has. KD should be working now to assess, and possible fill, those holes. i.e. Soder is likely not the answer in net, or a backup. Are Commesso or Stauber? If not, KD should be looking since Mrazek won't be the long-term solution. |
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Post by hsbob on Apr 18, 2024 12:14:47 GMT -6
The previous build was as perfect as a build's gonna get IMO,it's a high bar to measure-up to and nearly unparalleled in the cap era. I won't say every move was perfect but I recall few if any "regrettable" moves myself. The cap gutted the 11&12 teams and my only regret was the puck bouncing-in off Ledy in OT of the 2014 WCF game seven. If this rebuild was at the very begining,more shuffling out of warm bodies would be required but I don't see it at the very beginning. There's still a good number of prospects from the previous regime and the team's already drafted five times in the 1st,five times in the 2nd and five times in the 3rd just in the past two years with even more surpluses in the bank the next 2-3 drafts. Some prospects will undoubtedly be moved out,but if all seven picks in the first 3 rounds are retained this summer,it'll give the team aprox thirty in-system kids from rounds 1-3 alone to go along with later round picks......the team will have amassed SEVEN 1st round picks in three consecutive drafts. I think these numbers suggest the rebuild should be well on it's path and the presence of Bedard,the immergence of Vlasic and KK to a lesser extent and Kurashev's encouraging play should have some impact on the trajectory too. Continuing to shuffle warm bodies in and out could have a less than ideal effect on these good,young players if it goes on for too long. The kids will need a few years to develop and some time to get their legs under them once they're up with the big club,but what kind of atmosphere do we want these kids to develop in? No one's advocating for the late 20's max-term,max-money UFA,but the team will have it's draft foundation in place after this summer,targeting an age appropriate,talented forward or two who'll be in their mid 20's in a few years helps the kids that are here in the meantime and offers better support for the kids to come. I don't expect much over the next two seasons but a competitive atmosphere would be advantageous and Jr's gonna have to shit or get off the pot at some point. I seem to recall that after 2010, there were some missteps in the offseason where Stan mishandled a couple of signings leaving the team wanting in 2011 and 2012, which was promptly and resoundingly fixed in 2013. All's well that ends well of course, don't get me wrong. I look at this build as from the beginning for now because we don't know how many of the previous gen guys will play out--Bowman was trying to build an entirely different team; one based around Dach and Jones. KD isn't. There's a chance they contribute to the current build, or they're just stops along the way like the ABC line or Ruutu--but we're only seeing what the ABC line or Ruutu are with no foreknowledge past the spring of 2006. Unfortunately, neither the trade market nor the FA market will have every long-term piece we need right now for the right price. The pieces we can get via trade, FA, and draft/develop hopefully will come as soon as possible, but until they do we'll have to round out the roster. For those players, it should not be long term; the deals should be movable. But, that being said this year has shown us a lot as to where everyone is and what holes the lineup has. KD should be working now to assess, and possible fill, those holes. i.e. Soder is likely not the answer in net, or a backup. Are Commesso or Stauber? If not, KD should be looking since Mrazek won't be the long-term solution. "Previous gen guys" Vlasic and Kurashev HAVE panned-out. Reichel disappointed but Slaggert surprised. Two young D-men saw substantial time and two more got a taste,that leaves 20yro 1st rounder Allen still in the system along with a few promising forwards. Most of those young "previous gen guys" have size too. Drew Commesso was taken at #46 over-all,he had three stellar NCAA seasons with a quality program(BU),and a nice first year at The Rock. That by itself,to go along with five 1st's,five 2nd's and five 3rd's from the last two drafts and 2-3-2 more due this summer should put a rebuild well on it's path. Add Bedard and KK to the mix and things could go a bit quicker,Nazar won't take long either IMO. Many quality,young acquisitions have been suggested,if you and Jr want to ignore em.....that's your business. Many RFA age players get moved every year,Philly got Tippett and a 1st for Giroux,MN got Faber and a 1st for Fiala,Buffalo got Thompson and a 1st and a 2nd for O'Rielly,Tuch,Krebs,a 1st and a 2nd for Eichel,NJ traded for Timo Meier,TB scooped-up a 23yro Hagle,Det got 25yro D-Cat and the Avs have added many of their good young players through trade. These are only a few of many examples.....the trade and FA markets are what a shrewd GM makes of them. Identifying and assessing the proper young players to target takes a certain skill-set and a leap of faith sometimes,look at Taige Thompson and Nick Paul's offensive production before being acquired by their current teams. This might explain why our 'next gen' GM has opted exclusively for picks......and old,over-paid players. |
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Post by squishy24 on Apr 18, 2024 14:57:39 GMT -6
In response to hsbob “ Many quality,young acquisitions have been suggested,if you and Jr want to ignore em.....that's your business. Many RFA age players get moved every year,Philly got Tippett and a 1st for Giroux,MN got Faber and a 1st for Fiala,Buffalo got Thompson and a 1st and a 2nd for O'Rielly,Tuch,Krebs,a 1st and a 2nd for Eichel,NJ traded for Timo Meier,TB scooped-up a 23yro Hagle,Det got 25yro D-Cat and the Avs have added many of their good young players through trade. These are only a few of many examples.....the trade and FA markets are what a shrewd GM makes of them.” (didnt want to quote the whole thing)
I am one of skeptics that say cash strapped teams do not trade away young players with cost controlled low caphits and high ceiling for picks and other prospects. Lundell and Pinto were mentioned before. From your quoted example above, we do not have any Fiala or Giroux or Oreilly to give away even if we want to. Is there another “scorched earth” rebuilding team that will give away a Hagel or a Dcat?
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Post by hsbob on Apr 19, 2024 7:12:31 GMT -6
In response to hsbob “ Many quality,young acquisitions have been suggested,if you and Jr want to ignore em.....that's your business. Many RFA age players get moved every year,Philly got Tippett and a 1st for Giroux,MN got Faber and a 1st for Fiala,Buffalo got Thompson and a 1st and a 2nd for O'Rielly,Tuch,Krebs,a 1st and a 2nd for Eichel,NJ traded for Timo Meier,TB scooped-up a 23yro Hagle,Det got 25yro D-Cat and the Avs have added many of their good young players through trade. These are only a few of many examples.....the trade and FA markets are what a shrewd GM makes of them.” (didnt want to quote the whole thing) I am one of skeptics that say cash strapped teams do not trade away young players with cost controlled low caphits and high ceiling for picks and other prospects. Lundell and Pinto were mentioned before. From your quoted example above, we do not have any Fiala or Giroux or Oreilly to give away even if we want to. Is there another “scorched earth” rebuilding team that will give away a Hagel or a Dcat? If cash strapped teams want to keep their best players,they have little choice but to part with young players and they're not cost controlled for very long anymore. I've listed example after example. The Canucks had no real spot for Dickinson and they considered his meager 2.65M hit more valuable than the player,he came here,saw a bigger opportunity and flourished. I'm not advocating for top RFA's who'd cost a fortune in return and salary,but thre are good young players who'll be on the move again this summer.....like every summer. This takes thorough assessment and often a leap faith if a young player hasn't developed quickly,look at Dickinson's numbers before he got here,same with Taige Thompson,Owen Tippett and Nick Paul's numbers before they joined their current teams. We don't have the highly sought after players left to trade,but when we had em,our GM opted for draft picks exclusively,this is rare,most teams get pick(s) and prospect(s) in return when they move sought after players. We do have a massive surplus of high picks to offer though,and a system that's getting pretty crowed. There'll be teams with an over-abundance of players at a certain position and teams in go for it mode w/o the cap-space to sign a young player due for a substantial raise. I try to go over other team's rosters and then see what Capfriendly says,but then again.......I might just be pullin' it outta my ass too. |
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Post by ebonyraptor on Apr 19, 2024 10:01:02 GMT -6
The Hawks 2023/24 season is over. Is that a good thing or a bad thing? I suppose "yes" would be the appropriate answer.
In keeping with the theme of this thread - I plan to have expectations - maybe later today or tomorrow or next week. But not now and not by choice - that frame of mind is simply not ready - not there - not yet.
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Post by hawkfaninpdx on Apr 19, 2024 15:26:21 GMT -6
I would say that a reasonable expectation for next year is for the Hawks to claw their way back to mediocrity. Maybe around 80pts? Which will be nowhere near of what's needed to make the playoffs, but they won't be absolute bottom feeders, where each team playing them can just pencil in a win.
25-26 season, assuming some of the draft picks start to pan out, is when they can start thinking in terms of playoffs. At least, they shouldn't be out of the picture by the middle of December.
There are enough free agents for the Hawks to bid on, who will improve the team.
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Post by ebonyraptor on Apr 19, 2024 16:10:57 GMT -6
I would say that a reasonable expectation for next year is for the Hawks to claw their way back to mediocrity. Maybe around 80pts? Which will be nowhere near of what's needed to make the playoffs, but they won't be absolute bottom feeders, where each team playing them can just pencil in a win. 25-26 season, assuming some of the draft picks start to pan out, is when they can start thinking in terms of playoffs. At least, they shouldn't be out of the picture by the middle of December. There are enough free agents for the Hawks to bid on, who will improve the team. Your expectations for next season is largely dependent on what KD does this offseason. If it's about what I expect - than my expectation for the season would be closer to 70pts than 80pts - but still that's 9 more wins than this season. I think the playoff sniffing will commence in the 2026/27 season. |
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Post by hawkinmontreal on Apr 19, 2024 17:50:46 GMT -6
I like everyone’s reasonably expectations, but wasting another 3 seasons so the Hawks can reach mediocre status is not going to sit well with the future of this team. Bedard will certainly not stand for that, as did Mcdavid in Edmonton when the team was constantly struggling. CB will not accept 3 more bottom feeding seasons, because the Hawks upper management believe they have far superior prospects in college and junior than other teams, KD needs to get his ass in gear and clear out guys like Raddyish and entwistle and the 2 Johnson’s, players like Zaitsev and other ankle weights on the backend. Management needs to start filling out the lineup with NHL calibre players, the team needs size and strength and as prospects prove they are capable of being pro you let them make the jump. With 35million in cap room KD can certainly make this roster a hell of lot better next year. Hell give Stamkos a number he can’t resist to play with Bedard, there are lots of options it’s time now to start moving forward.
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Post by OldTimeHawky on Apr 19, 2024 23:16:21 GMT -6
The last GM never did a rebuild but his picks going back to 2019 are definitely part of KDs.
Vlasic, Del Mastro, Kaiser, Allan, Phillips, and Crevier are all pro now, huge Harding will surprise some people when he turns pro. KD will have some tough choices to make.
Up front there's not as many from the last guy, Reichel, Slaggert, Dach, and a few fridge players. Plus Commesso in net.
But KD mostly drafted forwards his first 2yrs, so with the D from the last guy, plus Commesso, this team will have depth at every position very soon and it'll trickle down to Rockford and Indy.
So I think in 2yrs the Hawks will be a playoff team and they might surprise some people. Bedard will be the captain, 20yrs old, and probably 200lbs. He'll be ready to lead this team.
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Post by hawkinmontreal on Apr 20, 2024 6:45:35 GMT -6
The last GM never did a rebuild but his picks going back to 2019 are definitely part of KDs. Vlasic, Del Mastro, Kaiser, Allan, Phillips, and Crevier are all pro now, huge Harding will surprise some people when he turns pro. KD will have some tough choices to make. Up front there's not as many from the last guy, Reichel, Slaggert, Dach, and a few fridge players. Plus Commesso in net. But KD mostly drafted forwards his first 2yrs, so with the D from the last guy, plus Commesso, this team will have depth at every position very soon and it'll trickle down to Rockford and Indy. So I think in 2yrs the Hawks will be a playoff team and they might surprise some people. Bedard will be the captain, 20yrs old, and probably 200lbs. He'll be ready to lead this team. I like your optimism but you can’t have a team full of kids, even though we only saw a small sample size it’s hard to believe Crevier, Philps and or Kaiser will ever be full time on this team. With having Vlasic, Korchinski, and one of Allen, Demastro mixed with some vets that can work. Defense is a tough position can’t expect 18-20 year old to develop at a pace to be ready in 2 years. You speak of Commesso, we have seen nothing that says he will be an NHL goalie and ready for a full time stint for the Hawks. KD needs to fill the roster with a mix of talent from top to bottom. Everyone talks about how the Hawks won those 3 cups, they don’t win those with out players like Bolland, Brouwer, Versteeg, Buff, Frolik, Kruger, Bickell KD needs to start working on this, there are players available this summer to start. |
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Post by OldTimeHawky on Apr 20, 2024 11:21:31 GMT -6
The last GM never did a rebuild but his picks going back to 2019 are definitely part of KDs. Vlasic, Del Mastro, Kaiser, Allan, Phillips, and Crevier are all pro now, huge Harding will surprise some people when he turns pro. KD will have some tough choices to make. Up front there's not as many from the last guy, Reichel, Slaggert, Dach, and a few fridge players. Plus Commesso in net. But KD mostly drafted forwards his first 2yrs, so with the D from the last guy, plus Commesso, this team will have depth at every position very soon and it'll trickle down to Rockford and Indy. So I think in 2yrs the Hawks will be a playoff team and they might surprise some people. Bedard will be the captain, 20yrs old, and probably 200lbs. He'll be ready to lead this team. I like your optimism but you can’t have a team full of kids, even though we only saw a small sample size it’s hard to believe Crevier, Philps and or Kaiser will ever be full time on this team. With having Vlasic, Korchinski, and one of Allen, Demastro mixed with some vets that can work. Defense is a tough position can’t expect 18-20 year old to develop at a pace to be ready in 2 years. You speak of Commesso, we have seen nothing that says he will be an NHL goalie and ready for a full time stint for the Hawks. KD needs to fill the roster with a mix of talent from top to bottom. Everyone talks about how the Hawks won those 3 cups, they don’t win those with out players like Bolland, Brouwer, Versteeg, Buff, Frolik, Kruger, Bickell KD needs to start working on this, there are players available this summer to start. This thread is about realistic expectations for a couple years from now. I never said all of those dmen will make it, just said they're pro now. And they're all 20yrs old and up, so I fully expect SOME of them to be developed and ready in 2yrs. Vlasic is playing full time on the top2, Del Mastro is the Hogs rookie of the year and Allan, also his first year pro, was voted the best defenseman. Those 3 could be half of the D core in 2yrs. It helps Del Mastro and Allan won gold with Bedard, Dach, and Korchinski. Kaiser, Phillips, and Crevier are close but still unknown. Commesso is only in his first year as a pro, so of course he hasn't played any NHL games yet, but he should get some next season and maybe a bigger role in 2yrs. He has the potential, the last goalie the Hawks drafted in the 2nd round before Drew was Crow. And KD drafted a lot of guys that could be those important role players, plus he traded for Dickinson and there will be more added through trades and signings. So I'm optimistic this team will be in the playoffs in 2yrs. |
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Post by hsbob on Apr 20, 2024 13:23:24 GMT -6
If we look past this team's massive collection of quality draft capitol and already,highly-rated prospect system,we see the arrivals of Bedard,Kurashev,Vlasic and very possibly KK as young main-stays IMO. Now.......not in three years....now. If the 'future' isn't accounted for after this summer's draft,it'll never be.
The present? That leave's the current and the unprecedented amount of cap-space/flexibility that's the envy of the league the team has going forward. There'll be sizable extensions due but there'll also be young players on cheap ELC's joining the roster over the years to come as well.
Cap-space,the trade market and the UFA market are only what shrewd GM's make of them and to be honest,ours is under no pressure to make moves that don't favor the Org at present. If the right opportunities present themselves this summer,I believe they can and should be acted on,if not,more stop-gaps but that can last for only so long. The money needed to reach the floor alone should prove to be a marked improvement......how much more efficiently can just the 9.5M paid to T Johnson and Zaitsev be used?
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Post by ebonyraptor on Apr 20, 2024 15:04:12 GMT -6
Where do the Hawks stand on 2024/25 cap space allocated to players under contract:
Forwards = $26M (9): Hall, Foligno, Dickenson, Athansiou, Kurashev, Donato, Bedard, Nazar, Slaggert
D-men = $15M (3): Jones, Murphy, Korchinski
Goalies = $6M (2): Mrazek, Soderblom
Other = $3M (2): McCabe, Bailey
Anticipated re-signings = $8M (2): Vlassic, Reichel
Total allocated = $58M (16 roster spots - still need 7 more roster spots)
Anticipate cap floor/ceiling: $64.5M / $87M
The Hawks will have $29M in cap space to sign 3 more forwards and 4 more d-men.
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Post by ebonyraptor on Apr 20, 2024 17:04:32 GMT -6
I didn't hear KD's interview today but Ben Pope tweeted this:
Kyle Davidson says he realizes now is the time the Blackhawks need to start ascending. They might not be playoff contenders next year, but he’s ready to begin building up. They can’t finish bottom-three in the league again.
Music to our ears. Taking the next step - Phase-2 of the rebuild will start this summer. Hallelujah!
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Post by BigT on Apr 20, 2024 19:15:41 GMT -6
I didn't hear KD's interview today but Ben Pope tweeted this: Kyle Davidson says he realizes now is the time the Blackhawks need to start ascending. They might not be playoff contenders next year, but he’s ready to begin building up. They can’t finish bottom-three in the league again. Music to our ears. Taking the next step - Phase-2 of the rebuild will start this summer. Hallelujah! Remember a wee bit ago I put up an Einstein quote? "We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them." With that said…. Again. KD has to change his train of thoughts here. Tearing down is one thing. But can he actually build this back up. Can’t wait forever on draft picks. Gotta start looking forward. I wasn’t sure if KD was ready to do that. I’d like to see a few decent players brought in. With the draft capital available. I’d love to see some of it moved out for some decent young players!!! |
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Post by 2old4this on Apr 20, 2024 19:20:09 GMT -6
I didn't hear KD's interview today but Ben Pope tweeted this: Kyle Davidson says he realizes now is the time the Blackhawks need to start ascending. They might not be playoff contenders next year, but he’s ready to begin building up. They can’t finish bottom-three in the league again. Music to our ears. Taking the next step - Phase-2 of the rebuild will start this summer. Hallelujah! Sounds like he reads this board! |
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Post by bigbarn27 on Apr 20, 2024 20:21:08 GMT -6
I didn't hear KD's interview today but Ben Pope tweeted this: Kyle Davidson says he realizes now is the time the Blackhawks need to start ascending. They might not be playoff contenders next year, but he’s ready to begin building up. They can’t finish bottom-three in the league again. Music to our ears. Taking the next step - Phase-2 of the rebuild will start this summer. Hallelujah! STH numbers must not have been that great. Good to hear |
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Post by hsbob on Apr 21, 2024 9:37:10 GMT -6
I didn't hear KD's interview today but Ben Pope tweeted this: Kyle Davidson says he realizes now is the time the Blackhawks need to start ascending. They might not be playoff contenders next year, but he’s ready to begin building up. They can’t finish bottom-three in the league again. Music to our ears. Taking the next step - Phase-2 of the rebuild will start this summer. Hallelujah! Remember a wee bit ago I put up an Einstein quote? "We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them." With that said…. Again. KD has to change his train of thoughts here. Tearing down is one thing. But can he actually build this back up. Can’t wait forever on draft picks. Gotta start looking forward. I wasn’t sure if KD was ready to do that. I’d like to see a few decent players brought in. With the draft capital available. I’d love to see some of it moved out for some decent young players!!! I like the sound of this and if done properly with acquiring age appropriate players,it does nothing but benefit the kids already here and the kids to come. I could be more open to the older player too I guess,and a guy like Skinner with the proper sweetener can be an option,his cap-hit can certainly be absorbed........it's quite the F'n luxury! BUT.....do this only if you add a quality,YOUNG player or two also.......preferably two.......preferably forwards. The cap'll be 92M in two years and more than likely 95M the following year. I'll continue to beat the drum for the 22-25yro age range player with a decent amount of big league experience already under their belts for additions. These would basically be teammates with the same generational interests as the kids already here,probably un-married and could grow and further develop alongside a Bedard. Foligno's been nothing short of awesome since he got here and a nice get by the young GM but a few teammates just a few years older than our kids,who've already seen some adversity and come-in relishing a bigger opportunity,AND will still be here in 4-5 years is a different prospective altogether for younger players IMO. |
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Post by ebonyraptor on Apr 22, 2024 13:40:48 GMT -6
With KD's comments indicating it's time to take the next step in the rebuild process getting a lot of attention - I think it's worth noting that KD did not change the "rebuild plan". The plan was always going to transition from "tank mode prospect accumulation" to "build up and try to win" - the only question was when that transition would take place.
This thread was started because it seemed to me the transition from Phase-1 to Phase-2 would take (at least) a year longer than I originally thought when this all started a couple years ago and hence I thought my expectations needed to be adjusted. Maybe I was a bit premature - or maybe not. KD's proclamation is good to hear but so far they are mere intention. That's half the battle I suppose - intending to do something needs to happen before actually doing something but willing to do something doesn't always line up with able to do something.
So do my expectations need to be amended again? I think my expectations need to be deferred until after the July 1st free agency period.
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Post by BigT on Apr 23, 2024 22:06:50 GMT -6
I think getting Bedard changed things. I don’t think they want to disappoint the kid and keep on tanking. If I were GM. I would like to have 3 years in the bottom 5, then build back up. So I feel the Hawks have had 3 years in the bottom 5. Unfortunately due to the Seth trade. Hawks had no first rounder. However they ended up with 3.
I believe KD when he talks. He’s not bullshitting. I think he’s getting rid of the guys that mailed it in, like TJ and a couple others. So I think we’ll see 2-3 free agents. Probably not big big names. But guys that can help stop the bleeding. Then he’ll try and pick up a good player or two in trades. He’s gonna want to make Bedard happy and keep it that way. There’s always future trades when kids are ready. They can trade the guys they will sign this off season, if the kids are ready. It should be exciting this off season!!!
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Post by ebonyraptor on Apr 23, 2024 23:21:27 GMT -6
I don't think KD has to acquire more that 2 guys as long as those 2 guys meet the requirements. I know - easier said than done but I don't think 3 or 4 mediocre guys helps nearly as much as 2 perfect-fit type guys.
On defense I think Vlassic-Jones is a good top pair that doesn't need to change. I think Murphy is not really a good 2nd pair guy but would be a good bottom pair guy paired with a good quick defender that needs to be paired with a partner with some size - like Kaiser (Keith-Seabrook lite), That leaves Korchinski on the 2nd pair in need of a veteran solid shutdown partner.
Vlassic-Jones
Korchinski-NEW GUY
Kaiser-Murphy
I think that would be a significant improvement to the group we played most of the season with.
I think the same rationale should be used to acquire a solid top-6 winger who consistently scores goals - a consistent 30-goal scorer - minimum. He plays on Bedard's Left Wing and keep Kurashev on Bedard's Right Wing. Construct the rest of the forward lines with the players we already have on the NHL roster - Hall, Nazar, Reichel, Atahasiou, Slaggert, Dickenson, Foligno, Donato, Anderson(?), and a couple open slots for Rockford guys getting tryouts.
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Post by bigbarn27 on Apr 24, 2024 7:23:15 GMT -6
I think getting Bedard changed things. I don’t think they want to disappoint the kid and keep on tanking. If I were GM. I would like to have 3 years in the bottom 5, then build back up. So I feel the Hawks have had 3 years in the bottom 5. Unfortunately due to the Seth trade. Hawks had no first rounder. However they ended up with 3. I believe KD when he talks. He’s not bullshitting. I think he’s getting rid of the guys that mailed it in, like TJ and a couple others. So I think we’ll see 2-3 free agents. Probably not big big names. But guys that can help stop the bleeding. Then he’ll try and pick up a good player or two in trades. He’s gonna want to make Bedard happy and keep it that way. There’s always future trades when kids are ready. They can trade the guys they will sign this off season, if the kids are ready. It should be exciting this off season!!! You are right on with this they had a skeleton crew working business opps and I believe the plan was to be bad for 5 years. After the draft they had to scramble to hire people cancelled on ice activities for prospect camp in part because they did not know how to handle it. Now you have this face of the league organization comes off as asses if they let him tank for 3 more years. I can tell when KD is throwing out BS he always follows his BS with. With that being said.......... It will be a little exciting this summer hopefully no more blue light specials time to see what this analytical department can do. |
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Post by hsbob on May 2, 2024 10:17:39 GMT -6
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